Okay, so I stumbled upon a Best-Vess connection; well, not a direct connection, but more of a very distant, extremely short, yet interesting connection…
I am in the process of mapping out every VESS record I can find prior to 1850. Of course, it is pretty wide-spread, but I am looking for individuals with the VESS name who claim to be born prior to 1800. So far, it’s been an effective strategy; however, I fell off task when I stumbled upon an unknown William Vess. Needless to say, I had to check it out!
His name was in the middle of a lengthy book about the HOFFMAN family [The Hoffmans of North Carolina Posted 29 Apr 2010 by Lynn Shore-Ancestry.com]. But, what really caught my attention (scrolling through the pages) was a list of familiar families (such as Jones, Hovis, Lineberger, and Palmer) that I often come across during my research as families who were living near Peter or Nathan at one time or another. So, who were the Hoffmans?? Honestly, I’ve never heard of them.
The Hoffmans
According to The Hoffmans of North Carolina ,(scrolling back a few pages), Elizabeth Hoffman, who married Jacob Palmer, is the daughter of “pioneer” Jacob Hoffman and Catherine Best (Katerina Margaretha Bosch) from Germany.
YES, you read that correctly: BEST! AND…Catherine Best is the sister of Boston Best (Sebastian Bosch Jr.)!
Earlier in my research, I stumbled upon Boston Best near the Gosnell family in Lincoln County, North Carolina [below], before the Gosnell family settled in Glassy Mountain, Greenville, South Carolina with the Bellew family. Remember: Nathan Vess married Clarinda Bellew, whose mother is Clarinda Gosnell.
A Distant, Extremely Short, Yet Interesting Connection
Of course, I was super excited to find a VESS in a book (any book) related to the Best family!
Without a birth date noted, I couldn’t tell where this William Vess fell on the Vess family tree. In fact, I was hoping to find a new Vess family, for that I am not aware of any Vess family living in Lincoln County, North Carolina during the early 1800’s.
However, after a little digging, I found him. He is William Madison Vess, son of Andrew Jackson Vess and Ruth Elizabeth Palmer and grandson of Nathan Vess and Clarinda Bellew.
He was born in 1852 and married Matilda Caroline Jones, whose 2nd great-grandmother is Catherine Best (Katerina Margaretha Bosch).
Above, can give us an idea of just how interconnected all these different families were during the 1800’s. I mean, Carolina Jones and William Vess are pretty much distant cousins and they probably didn’t even know it. So, technically, we do have a few distant Vess cousins (the descendants of Caroline Jones and William Vess) who are descendants of the Best family from Germany. But so far, no direct BEST-VESS connections.
Anyway, I just wanted to share with you one of my usual research experiences, where I start doing one thing and eventually get stuck on a totally different thing! It is amazing where research takes us! Although not a significant finding, it was still worth checking out!
With the holidays over, I am ready to tackle this pile of information everyone has provided me about Vess Genealogy!
Surprisingly, what I ended up doing was tossing my entire research book in the trash and starting over!
My research on Peter Vess is complete! Stick a fork in it and call it done (for now, at least). It is now time to shift my focus towards Nathan and Willis, to see if I can dig deeply into their past as deeply as I have dug into Peter’s past.
I do hope my extensive research on Peter’s neighbors and Nathan’s South Carolina origins, will be helpful in making a possible connection with Willis Vess.
Willis Vess: Scratching The Surface
This weekend, I began to take a deeper look at Willis Vess and stumbled upon research left by genealogist, Anna Popejoy.
I do not know who Anna is (or was) or her connection to Willis VESS, but bits and pieces of her extensive research pops up here and there; especially, in regards to the Whitlock family (perhaps that was her connection). She clearly had a passion for genealogy and (it seems like) history too! Her research intrigues me and I am absolutely eager to discover more!
DNA Confirms A Relation
According to Familytreedna.com (Y-Chromosome Testing), Willis VESS and Peter VESS are indeed related, but where on the family tree do they connect?
Looking at the information above, there is no telling how closely related they may be with one another.
Does Willis share a father with Peter, a grandparent, a great-grandparent, or are they connect through a great-great-great grandparent from across the Atlantic? Hopefully, further research can give us a better idea…
More Closely Related Than We Think
Autosomal DNA testing (like Ancestry DNA and 23andMe) allows us to connect lineages that are “closely” related (5-6 generations back). The older the generation testing, the further back you can go in time.
In theory, if descendants of Willis Vess/Vest appear as shared DNA relatives (Ancestry.com), there is a really good chance that he is pretty close to Peter Vess on the family tree.
Surprisingly, I do have a few descendants of Willis Vess/Vest coming up on my Ancestry DNA matches as 4th-6th cousins. That means we likely share a 3rd, 4th, or 5th grandparent. Which is extremely exciting, for that my fourth great-grandparent on the VESS side is Peter Vess!
But how can I tell for sure he is related to the VESS line?
Well, my half-aunt and my mom did their DNA test too, which allows me to further separate my parents paternal lines and the results I came across are really exciting!!
My Aunt and I share several DNA relatives who are descendants of Willis Vess/Vest, in which my mom does not have any DNA relation with at all- confirming a VESS connection with the Willis VESS/VEST line!
Interestingly, we share 1 DNA relative who is a descendant of John P. Vess, brother of Willis Vess!
I have another DNA relative who is the descendant of Willis Vess through his son Henry Russell Vess, but he/she doesn’t show up as a shared relative on my Aunt’s DNA results; however, this DNA relative has shared matches with other Vess DNA relatives and does-not show up on my mom’s DNA results either.
Because my Aunt is a generation older than me, her DNA is able to pick up an extra generation of descendants and it shows the following:
2 DNA relatives who are descendants of Willis Vess through his sons, John Henry Vess and John Jackson Vess!
The best part, these DNA relatives are also her 4th-6th cousins. That puts Willis Vess very close to Peter Vess on the family tree! Willis and Peter might share a parent or grandparent!
Of course, DNA matches can’t provide us with all the answers we seek; instead, it just kind of points us in a very vague direction.
Too Many Gaps
With another cup of coffee and 50 tabs open on my desktop, I am still digging…
I am trying to build a time-line (just as I did for Peter). According to records, Willis claims to be born in North Carolina (abt. 1812). He also claims both his parents were born in North Carolina. Interesting.
I have been researching North Carolina families for years and the only VESS/VEST family in North Carolina, on record, during the early 1800’s is William Tunwell VEST and his son John VEST who was born in Virginia (1768), settled in Fortysth, North Carolina, and married Elizabeth Ray. It is unlikely that Willis Vess is the son of William Tunwell Vess/Vest or John VEST. So, I’ve scratched him off the list and put him on the back burner.
There is still the VESS family in Patrick County, Virginia (which is located just above Stokes and Surry County, North Carolina). We might be related through them, but records are super scarce!
BUT, how do you explain Nathan Vess? According to his records, his parents supposedly were born in South Carolina. But, he seems more closely related to Peter than Willis (Perhaps Willis is a 1st cousin?).
And – nothing on Jonathan Vess (the 3rd so-called brother from Ireland). My research is beginning to largely suggest that he was probably an older ancestor (an uncle, father, or even grandfather to Peter and Nathan).
So, many questions!
Moving Backwards to Move Forward
Finding a new VESS line is super exciting!
Of course, I am going to have to do some more research for that I am not familiar with the history of Alabama (home of Willis Vess). In fact, when did people start settling in Alabama?
According to land records, Willis Vess/Vest obtained land as early as 1837 in Franklin County, Alabama (Huntsville area). His father, John Vess, supposedly had a cabin in Mountain Star, Alabama, which is not too far from Huntsville.
Pictured above (circled in red) is likely the area in which John and his son, Willis Vess lived in Franklin County, Alabama. Although this map is from 1908, you can still see many recognizable neighbors from earlier census records, including the Whitlock, Askew, and Willis families.
Help From Anna Popejoy and An Unknown Researcher
While browsing records on Ancestry.com, I stumbled upon an attached document linked to William Whitlock on someone’s family tree, titled, “Genealogy of Lou Pero.” I do not know who Lou Pero is nor does it state the name of the original author of these notes; however, the author noted that “a great deal of my information came from Anna Popejoy…” and this particular note pertained to William Whitlock providing information on when the Whitlocks migrated from Georgia to Alabama.
William Whitlock, is supposedly the father of Talitha Whitlock who is the wife of Willis VESS.
According to these notes, Anna wrote about “a wagon trail out of Georgia, October 10, 1821, to Franklin County, Alabama. Those of the Whitlock’s in the wagon train to were William, Elizabeth, Nathaniel, Hezekiah, and Talitha…” This information came from “Whitlock Gleanings, a genealogy workbook compiled by Thomas Edward Roach, 1984. This gives us a better idea as to when the Whitlocks came to Alabama! So, my next task, is to determine when and where Willis Vess came from!
I certainly have a lot of research to do! With a game plan, a starting point, I am super READY!!!
I am in the process of reviewing, sorting, and organizing new information. A HUGE thanks to everyone who has sent me information about different Vess family lines and history!
This is what I have gathered so far (off the top of my head).
Peter, Nathan, and John certainly exist, but their relation to one another is still not known.
Peter and Nathan are closely related per Ancestry DNA, but there is no documentation (probates, census records, family bibles, or anything) confirming their exact relation to each other.
Peter was born in North Carolina.
Nathan was born in South Carolina.
Y-Chromosome DNA is connecting our family (Peter and Nathan) to a Willis Vess (Vest) of Alabama whose father is John Vess who is supposedly from North Carolina. The relation between Peter, Nathan, and Willis is not known.
John Vess maybe an older ancestor (maybe a father or uncle to Peter and Nathan) for that his descendants from his generation do not show up on Ancestry.com. Ancerstry.com can only take us back 6-7 generations. [For me, that barely picks up Peter’s generation]
There is a pocket of “Vess” family in Patrick County, Virginia that does not seem to have any kind of relation to the Virginia VEST family.
There is a John Vess from Patrick County, VA who migrated to Texas in 1820 with Elizabeth Heron.
There is a Peter and Samuel Vess of Patrick County, VA who seem to have connections with the Vaughn family. Willis Vess’s mother is supposedly Margaret Vaughn.
Y-Chromosome DNA suggests a strong family relation with the HAYES, JONES, and TRAVERS families.
I feel like we have research on two ends of the timeline and we are trying to figure out how they meet in the middle.
I am putting the Vess family of Virginia aside and continuing my research on close neighbors and family members related to Peter and Nathan. Interestingly, the search has led me back to Surry County, NC.
A few months ago, the names of soldiers listed above meant nothing to me; but today, they are very significant.
SKIDMORE, POINDEXTER, EAPERSON, SPRINKLE, BAGLEY, COOK, PHILIPS, and MORELAND have connections with William Tunwell VEST through his son Issac VEST. Several men on this list married William Tunwell VEST’S grand-daughters.
Issac VEST is shown living in Wilkes County. Many of the soldiers listed above do not live in Surry County, but are a mix of residents from surrounding counties (including Wilkes). Although I cannot find Peter VEST on census anywhere around or in Surry County, I did find a BELLEW family in Wilkes County. Nathan’s wife is Clarinda BELLEW and they eventually settled in Glassy Mountain, Greenville, South Carolina.
I have a feeling that our family were “boarders” and likely lived with other families as they migrated down to the Carolinas (I mean, that is one possible explanation for the lack of records on them).
For right now, I will be investigating Wilkes county and its surrounding counties a little further. Probate records, so far, have been the most valuable source of connecting families together. Unfortunately, probate records are not perfectly indexed and require thorough reading to find other families. Super fun!
Have information to share? Please feel free to share it with us in the comment section below. Thanks! 🙂
I was recently asked if I knew anything about a Willis VESS and his connection to a John VESS.
Well, the short answer is: Very little.
But, I did stumbled upon new intriguing information that is probably worth brain storming…
I have a lot of research and I wouldn’t be surprised if the answers we seek about the VESS family are in plain sight somewhere in my messy genealogy files!
I say this, because I truly do not know how to start this post… Vess Genealogy is like trying to put together a zillion-piece puzzle with all the puzzle pieces face down! And there is always that one piece we keep going back to, because we know what general area it belongs to; but it doesn’t quite have a space for it to fit into yet.
Simply, I don’t know what I got until I come across it again.
With that said, I will start with Willis Vess.
Willis Vess of Alabama
Willis VESS (born abt. 1810) married Talitha WHITLOCK. Many researchers who I’ve spoken to have found connections to Willis VESS through the WHITLOCK family (including myself). I am related to Talitha WHITLOCK through my mother’s BENTLY side in Georgia.
Interestingly though, everyone seems to agree unanimouslythat Willis VESS is the son of a John VESS.
You can find a picture of his cabin on FindAGrave.com, posted by Anna Popejoy, who I’ve been told was a genealogist who has done Y-Chromosome testing.
We do not know who was tested specifically, as it had to be a male descendant, but supposedly there is a DNA connection between the Willis VESS line and the Peter VESS line. Where this connection is on the family tree is still a mystery.
According to online sources, John VESS was born abt. 1770 in North Carolina. He supposedly married Margaret VAUGHN and they had two sons: Willis VESS born abt. 1810 and John Peter VESS born abt. 1822.
According to my research, the VESS/VEST family from Virginia appears on record in North Carolina as early as 1790; obtaining land as early as 1798 (Stokes Co.). If they were in the area any earlier, it would have been Rowan County.
Many researchers (including myself) try to connect Willis VESS of Alabama to William Tunwell VEST (1735 VA-1812 NC) of Stokes County, North Carolina. But, research simply does not support any kind of connection between the two families (at least not directly).
William Tunwell VEST did have a son named John VEST. However, John VEST was born in Virginia (abt. 1765). He married Eliza RAY and you can follow him on several census records with his brothers (Charles, William, and SamuelVEST) in Stokes County, North Carolina. He died in 1833. So, he is likely not the father of Willis VESS.
Intriguing New Discoveries
Current research suggests that William Tunwell VEST may have not been the only VESS/VEST family in North Carolina!
I have been working on compiling VESS, VEST, VOSS, and VASS marriages from 1790-1820. Majority of the VEST marriages are in Stokes County, North Carolina with connections with William Tunwell VEST (his children and his grandchildren); however, there are a couple (very scarce) odd balls in neighboring counties (Surry and Wilkes) that do not seem to have any direct connection with William Tunwell VEST.
But even more intriguing…
Sources say the parents of Willis VESS are John VESS and Margret VAUGHN.
Well, while compiling marriage records, I found a PETER VEST and a “PUGNANCE VAUGHN” married on November 24, 1785 in Henry County, Virginia.
As mentioned in my last post, I have discovered a VESS family in Patrick County, Virginia who do not have any documented connections with anyone. Are they VESS or VEST?
Patrick County, VA was established in 1791 and was previously part of Henry County, VA. So, this Peter VEST (married to Pugnance VAUGHN) may be connected to the VESS family in Patrick County, VA.
Interestingly, this gives us a “Peter” VEST married in 1785 and a “Jonathan” Vess married in 1792. So, I couldn’t help but wonder... is there an older Nathaniel Vess?
There is! Well, a Nathaniel VEST, born 1791 in Virginia (died in Indiana). It is not just the name “Nathaniel” that intrigues me, but also his spouse, whose maiden name is “DUNCAN.”
Is his spouse, Lavina DUNCAN, related to the John DUNCAN who appears on the Patrick County, VA Land Tax record with Peter and Samuel VESS??
Also, note…I found a WHITLOCK too (bottom of a 1792 Patrick CO. Land Tax record).
As usual, this intriguing find does not seem to bring us any closer to connecting the Willis VESS line to the Peter/Nathan Vess line. Nor does it bring us any closer to finding out who Peter and Nathan’s parents are…
1) Although Nathaniel VEST of Virginia is not old enough to be the father of our Peter and Nathan Vess, Jonathan and Peter VESS/VEST (of Virginia) are, BUT…
2) Our Nathan VESS was supposedly born in South Carolina and so was his parents. [Ref. 1880 Mortality Record]
3) The parents of Willis VESS were supposedly born in North Carolina. [Ref.various census records]
4) Jonathan Vess of Patrick County, Virginia who married Elizabeth Heron migrated to Republic of Texas in 1820. [Ref. Texas history]
So, who is the John Vess on Peter’s 1830 land record??
Other information that might relate to Willis VESS:
1) 1860 census record states Willis VESS was born in Indiana, but all other census records state he was born in North Carolina.
2) There is supposedly a Willis VESS in South Carolina. I will check my notes again.
3) Talitha WHITLOCK was born in Georgia (abt. 1820). Her mother is Elizabeth GREEN.
Peter’s son, Josiah VESS has a connection with a GREEN family in Rutherford County, NC through his spouse, Zilla Early. I will look to see if there are any connections.
4) Peter’s son Alfred VESS migrated to Georgia after the Civil War and I often wondered, if there was already family out there or if the war landed him there.
5) Supposedly Peter’s line eventually made it up to Indiana, but I cannot remember when or who went up there. I am not familiar with any family from Peter’s line moving to Alabama. I will double check though.
What Are Your Thoughts?
I don’t have enough evidence to make any solid conclusions about the VESS family in Patrick County, VA, but I did want to share my findings with everyone.
Please feel free to share your thoughts in the comments section or join us on the Vess Genealogy Facebook Group.
Anyone who has researched Peter Vess, has likely come across a “Peter Vest” on a War of 1812-1814 military service record for Surry County, North Carolina. Unfortunately, there are no other records to support a connection with our Peter Vess.
I can honestly tell you, the Surry County, NC War of 1812 record, meant very little to me a month ago; but now, after extensively researching different families in North Carolina, a few names on this record stand out in which require further investigation…
Earlier Research: William Tunwell Vest
My earlier research on the VEST family largely focused around a William Tunwell Vest of Stokes County, North Carolina.
According to an 1812 probate record, he had a wife named Lucy (ALFORD) and they had 9 children: Samuel, Charles, William Jr., Isham, John, Elizabeth, Polly, Jenny (Jane) and Mary.
The only interesting thing I found in regards to William Tunwell Vest is a neat account regarding his son Charles Erwin Vest:
Summary: In 1792, the Board of Commissioners came together in search of a person who would manage a building project for the “Statehouse.”
Later documents suggest it was the rebuilding of the Guilford Courthouse.
Charles Vest [whose occupation, on census records, states manufacture] “made an offer;” however, “never reported his estimate.” The project was then appointed to Rhodham Atkins.
North Carolina Digital Collection
Unfortunately, there are no records connecting the VEST and VESS families together.
I think many VESS researchers are attracted to William Tunwell VEST, because at first glance, he truly makes a great lead in Vess Genealogy:
1) VESS and VEST are similar surnames and we do find many records for our Peter under the surname VEST.
2) He lives in North Carolina. According to census records, our Peter was supposedly born in North Carolina.
3) He is from Virginia. According to our family story, our VESS family traveled from Virginia to the Carolinas.
4) His sons are old enough to be Peter’s father and one of them was named “John.”
“Charles” Peter Vess May Not Exist
Sometimes, you might see the name “Charles Peter VESS” as Peter Vess of Rutherford County, North Carolina.
In my opinion, I do not think there is a “Charles” Peter Vess and that the name originated from researchers trying to connect Peter Vess to the William Tunwell VEST line.
See, Charles Erwin VEST (son of William Tunwell VEST) had a son named Charles VEST Jr., who married a woman named Catherine. [*Correction: Catharina] I strongly believe that many quickly assumed thathad to bePeter [Vess] and Catharine “Katy” [Cook] and therefore, “Charles” must be Peter’s first name.
Unfortunately, when new records began to reveal more about Charles Vest Jr. and his wife Catharina VOGLER (who married in 1809), the idea that Peter Vess is “Charles Peter Vess” was already stuck in circulation on the Internet.
But of course, I could be wrong.
The Vest Family: What I Do Know
The VEST family is just as complicated and fascinating as our VESS family.
You can find many public family trees related to the VEST family on Ancestry.com, MyHertiage.com, Familysearch.org, Wikitree.com, etc.; however, none seem to be consistent and very few offer solid records to support their findings.
I do not know where the VEST family comes from; however, some public VEST family trees date their lineage back to Germany through a MOSES VEST, born in 1650 Basel, Warendorf, Nordrhein-Westfalen, Germany. I have not come across any trees with attached documentation though; so I cannot confirm this is true.
VEST Family Tree: DRAFT (not entirely accurate)
I DO KNOW the VEST family originated in Powhatan and Chesterfield County, Virginia (1700’s) and migrated down to Bedford and Franklin County, before migrating west out of Virginia into Kentucky, Missouri, and Indiana; with the exception of William Tunwell Vest who migrated down into Stokes County, North Carolina.
Unfortunately, there are no records (as of yet) connecting the VEST and VESS families together, but there are still a few early VEST and VESS records lingering around without a connection to either family.
A “VESS” Family In Virginia
I cannot tell you how exciting it is to see the VESS name on early Virginia records!
Revolutionary War Records If you dig deep enough, you can find the “VESS” name on documents dating back as early as the Revolutionary War!
So far, I’ve uncovered a Peter and Samuel “VESS” on Revolutionary War records. I remember I found 3 of them, but I cannot remember the 3rd name (sorry).
Samuel Vess 1779 Revolutionary War record – Ancestry.com Corporal Peter Vess 1777 Revolutionary War record – Ancestry.com
Before dismissing them as VEST family though, I have found a pocket of VESS’s hanging out in Patrick County, Virginia in which I have yet to figure out whose tree they belong on (VESS or VEST).
Patrick County, Virginia Perhaps, Peter and Samuel Vess on the Revolutionary War records (above) are the same Peter and Samuel Vess listed on the 1790’s Patrick County Land Tax record.
The Samuel listed on the 1790 tax record could be Samuel Harvey VEST (b. 1757 VA), son of William Tunwell Vest. He would have been old enough to serve during the Revolutionary War and Patrick County, VA is just above Stokes County, North Carolina; however, there is no documentation to support it. I DO KNOW, the Peter listed above is too old to be our Peter Vess.
Interestingly, that’s not even the only VESS record for Patrick County, NC! There is also a marriage record for Jonathan VESS and Elizabeth HERON dated 1792.
This is supposedly, Jonathan Vess who traveled to the Republic of Texas in 1825 and helped establish Morales, Texas. I have no idea who his parents are and whether or not he is a VEST or a VESS.
And lastly, I have discovered a William VESS of (Koger Creek) Patrick County, Virginia on a Deed record located on RootsWeb.com.
Interestingly, other names listed beside him include JOHN DUNCAN (like John Duncan shown above with Peter and Samuel Vess) and a JAMES HERON, as in Elizabeth HERON who married Jonathan VESS. I am not sure if this William VESS is Jonathan “William” VESS, which is a name that is often associated with Jonathan VESS of Texas (married to Elizabeth Heron).
So, just a quick recap: There is a Peter, Samuel, Jonathan, and William (Jonathan and William might be the same) VESS in Patrick County, VA in the 1790’s that do not have any records connecting them to either the VEST or VESS family.
Unfortunately, early census records for Patrick County, VA have been lost. 😦 BUT, Patrick County, VA was created from Henry County in 1790, which was created from Pittslyvania County in 1776; in which, leads me back to the Peter VEST on the War of 1812-1814 military service record…
Many surnames on that record are connected to families who originated from Pittsylvania County, Virginia and some have connections to the VEST family (William Tunwell VEST) as well as the BELLEW family (Nathan’s wife’s family)!
Next Stop In Research: Virginia
I feel as if I am getting closer!!
I have not explored Virginia yet and I don’t think I would have been very successful at researching records in Virginia (in the beginning) without knowing what I know now.
Virginia is a tough state to research, for that early records are super scarce. If your family didn’t do anything significant, their record is likely not available yet, especially, digitally.
Digital records for Virginia are broadly Indexed and requires hours upon hours of scrolling through digitalized slides of records. Simply, you can’t just type in a specific name and it will take you directly to the record pertaining to that name…you have to know a time, place, and event and then search from there, deciphering scribbles from deteriorated records. Super fun!
But, I am motivated, excited, and ready for a new challenge!
I will be sure to post an update on my research soon!
My plans to update Vess Genealogy last weekend did not go as planned; however, EXCITING information did pop up in my email from two researchers who have been working on tracing family lines through Y-Chromosome testing!!
Y-Chromosome testing is a very valuable tool for genealogy, for that it can accurately trace parental lineages, but…only if there are enough male participants (only males have Y-Chromosomes) from different descending lines willing to test and share their results.
I have been told that there are no large scale Vess DNA projects out there (like the impressive West Family DNA Project); however, both researchers have introduced me to FamilyTreeDNA.com.
To me, all these haplogroup numbers look like gibberish, but I look forward to learning more about them! Genetics was one of my favorite subjects in college (Biology major), so this should be fun!
If you are a male descendant of the VESS or VEST family, I strongly encourage you to look into doing testing through FamilyTreeDNA.com. If you or someone you know has done Y-Chromosome testing through a different site (or in general), please share with us in the comments below!
I am super excited about this and I absolutely look forward to working with anyone who is willing to share their DNA (Y-Chromosome) results to help make family connections in our family tree!
Together, through DNA and records, I truly believe we can solve many family mysteries!
Confirmation: Vess and West Families Are NOT Related
According to both researchers who emailed me about their Y-Chromosome findings, “the VESS and WEST families are not related!”
For me, this is awesome news that couldn’t have come at a more perfect time!
I had just finished up my research on the WEST family prior to moving and did not have time to update my conclusions on Vess Genealogy, which is that I do not think the two families are related. So, I cannot begin to tell you how exciting it was to get confirmation from two different sources who were able to validate through DNA testing!
The search field for VESS ancestors has shrunk significantly after eliminating the WEST family as possible relatives. As you can see below, the WEST family pretty much dominates the Carolina’s in the early 1800’s. Removing them, leaves us with a smaller search area with the VEST, BEST, and VOSS families.
However, I have not completely shelved the WEST file yet! This is because there are a few (2-3) curious “WEST” names lingering around our family who do not seem to be connected to the well-documented WEST family; suggesting that these few WEST names might be a misspelled surname (perhaps for a VEST, BEST, or VESS ancestor). So, I plan to keep them in mind as I continue my research.
Where Do We Go From Here?
Believe it or not, but I do have a new lead!
Okay, actually, it’s an old lead that has become a new lead since gaining more information from other leads. Still with me?
It’s complicated, but I will explain further in my next post! 🙂
Now that I have a desk again (finished with moving), I hope to be posting way more often!
Are you a descendant of Peter, Nathan, or John Vess – check us out on Facebook:
I plan to really get Vess Genealogy going this month! When I started this site in August, I was in the midst of figuring out homeschooling with a 6 year-old and planning a huge family move! Now, things are beginning to settle down and I can start to focus on posting more often!
About VESS Genealogy: Short Recap
Oh my gosh, where to start?
I am the 4th great-granddaughter of Peter VESS/VEST (1791-1843) and Catherine “Katie” Cook (1804- bef. 1860) of Rutherford County, North Carolina (McDowell County, NC today). I am a descendant of Andrew Logan VESS (Peter’s 3rd son) and Malinda Lucy “Linnia” HALFORD.
I am the last leaf on a small branch of an ever expanding VESS family tree.
Andrew Logan Vess 1825-1905
Research shows that the VESS family tree in the United States is old and thick with many different family branches expanding coast to coast; all of which seem deeply rooted in early Colonial America.
According to my family line, “we descend from 3-brothers: Jonathan, Peter, and Nathan, who supposedly came to America from Ireland.”
However, documents discovered thus far, reveal a slightly different story: According to records, Peter was born in North Carolina and Nathan was born in South Carolina. Jonathan is still a mystery.
DNA (Ancestry DNA) does show a DNA relationship between Peter and Nathan’s families; however, there are no records connecting them as actual “brothers.” Yet, upon further investigation, we do find several interesting connections between their families (all of which I will share in future posts).
Again, the VESS family tree is extensive and the 3-brothers in my family’s story, are just a tip of the iceberg!
There are many VESS descending lines and not all of them connect to Peter, Nathan, or Jonathan. Interestingly, not all descending lines took the VESS name and it is widely agreed that VESS wasn’t even our original surname!
Search For Genealogy Gold: Vess Origins
Although there is much to discover and post about the VESS family in between 1820-present, I am more interested in discovering our family’s origins; the VESS family prior to 1820.
Researching any family prior to 1850 is challenging, thus why, I am having to investigate every VESS family line I can find, including other families (neighbors, spouses, community members, etc.) who may also have connections with the VESS family.
Vess genealogy is challenging, not only because of lack of records prior to 1850, but also the strong likelihood of a name change. The VESS name comes with many different name variants (VEST, VOSS, VOST, BOSS, BOST, BEST, WEST, VIST, VISS, VESTAL, VESTIL, VAUS, etc). Unfortunately, all these different name variants can be found together on early census records and some research shows, many of them being part of other families (misspelled names) and/or marrying one another with similar surnames. The goal is to sort, group, and investigate!
Updates, Information, and More
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As research continues, I will also be updating the bio’s of the three brothers, Jonathan, Peter, and Nathan Vess.
I also hope to upload family trees, pictures, family histories, and more!
Kind and genealogy-related comments are always welcome and if you have any information to provide regarding VESS genealogy, please feel free to contact me.
I absolutely look forward to discovering more about the VESS family with you!
Yesterday, I had this ingenious plan to locate the parents of Nathan Vess! Unfortunately, it isn’t the most easiest of ingenious plans.
I am a firm believer that the reason why Vess genealogy is so difficult, is because of a name change! The challenge now is figuring out what original surname our “Vess” name evolved from!
Here are my candidates based North and South Carolina census records 1790-1820.
VEST WEST BEST VOSS
Name variants (as found on census records): VIST VERT VASS BASS BOSS BESS WIST BOST VOST WISS VISS VAST BAST
My Monster SpreadSheet
I’ve decided to use a spreadsheet to track families with similar names in areas where I know some of Peter and Nathan’s neighbors and family have been.
So far, I am beginning to see distinct family migration patterns emerge…
As you can see, the WEST family is pretty widespread.
According to the WEST FAMILY DNA PROJECT, there are several different WEST lines with majority of them being connected to an orphan from England. There is also a West line connected to the Thomas West, Baron De La Warr and Benjamin West, an 18th century American artist.
UPDATE: According to several researchers who have done Y-chromosome research, it has been confirmed that there is no DNA relationship between Vess and West families. 🙂
Now, their DNA records do show that there is a West family connection with the South Carolina West family, but they do not know whose line they originate from. They also have a list of unrelated WEST families, with the assumption there was a name change at some point. Interestingly, while browsing the list, a few familiar names caught my eye.
Unfortunately, the WEST FAMILY DNA PROJECT website has been taken down or moved without a working link; so, I am unable to reference it again. However, I did manage to download a few pages of information the last time the website was active. 😉
Hopefully, with a little more investigation, I will be able to separate different WEST families.
Well, that is my project for the week!
Revisiting The VEST family
I did come across an interesting thing on the VEST family, but I don’t want to get side-tracked! I really need to work on the WEST family first. BUT, according to a BIO on FindMyGrave.com, for a VEST ancestor, it states their family is of “Scotch Irish origin.”
This is interesting for several reasons: 1) John Jay Vest is related to North Carolina Senator George Vest. 2) “Jay” is a surname that is related to both BEST and WEST families. And, middle names, especially, prior to the 1800’s, came from their mother or grandmother’s maiden name. 3) More importantly, this is the first time that I’ve seen anything stating the VEST family having Scot-Irish origins. Other family trees (a lot of them) have traced the VEST family to a Moses Vest (1600’s) from Germany.
This really needs further investigating…but first, the WEST family!
Andrew Logan Vess is one of my favorite ancestors to research, mostly because he actually exists on record! He has several records, which seems pretty rare for the Vess family!
Andrew “Andy” Logan Vess (1825-1905)
Nearly two hundred years ago, on April 25, 1825, Andrew Logan Vess was born in Rutherford County, North Carolina. He is the 3rd son of Peter Vess and Catherine “Katie” Crook.
Although records for Andrew Logan Vess are not entirely scarce, none actually pertain to his personal life.
Who he was as a man, husband, father and/or gentlemen is lost; however, we have been able to uncover several interesting events that occurred during his life.
Whereabouts He Grew Up
Records, as early as 1820, show Andrew’s parents, Peter and Catherine, living in Rutherford County, North Carolina.
Further research suggests that they were likely living somewhere on Knobs Creek near Bill’s Creek Baptist Church. Catherine’s father, John Crook, husband of Rachel Haynes, owned land next to her maternal grandfather’s land (William Haynes).
According to Helen M. Lu’s, Bill’s Creek Baptist Church: Two Hundred Year History, Peter and Catherine were members between 1829-1836, and Catherine’s grandfather, William Haynes, was one of the first pastors.
When Andrew Logan Vess was 6 years old, in 1831, his father obtained “100 acres of land on both sides of Cedar Creek in Rutherford County;” which has been narrowed down to an area located in today’s Broad River Township (now part of Buncombe County).
In 1838, records show his father, Peter Vess, was a member of Bethlehem Baptist Church of Burke County (now part of McDowell County); which is located not too far from his property in Broad River; which explains their absence from Bill’s Creek Baptist Church between 1836-1844.
Bethlehem Baptist Church was an extension of Bill’s Creek Baptist Church and both were part of the Catawba River Association (Helen M. Lu, pg. 15 & 86).
At the age of 19, in 1844, records show that Andrew’s mother, Catherine, returned to Bill’s Creek Baptist Church without Peter; suggesting that Peter may have died. According to deed records, Peter gave his land to a J. Souther, to cover a debt.
At the age of 21, in 1846, Andrew Logan Vess and his brothers, also become members of Bill’s Creek Baptist Church (without Peter), suggesting the family likely moved back to Knobs Creek.
First Wife: Linnia Halford
At the age of 24, on May 14, 1849, Andrew Logan Vess marries his first wife, Lucy Malinda “Linnia” Halford, the daughter of Thomas Halford and Sarah “Lollie” Jane Hill.
Andrew and Linnia had 7 children together: Calvin Bailey, William Columbus, James Harvey, John Alexander, Sarah Catherine, Pinkney Elcanah, and Thomas Logan.
John Alexander Vess, son of Andrew Vess and Linnia Halford (1857-1939) [Ancestry.com]From 1800’s cipher and practice book
In 1850, Andrew and his family are shown living near his in-laws, Thomas and Sarah Halford in Montford Cove, Rutherford County, North Carolina.
Military: Civil War
At the age of 38, on Sept. 1, 1863, Andrew Logan Vess joined the military. He served as a Confederate solider (private rank) under the 62nd Regiment, North Carolina Infantry, Company F.
Andrew served in the same Regiment as Nathan’s son, Abraham Vess of Haywood County. Unfortunately, Abraham was captured at Cumberland Gap and imprisoned at Douglass Camp. It does not look like Andrew was every captured nor are there any records indicating if he was ever wounded during his service.
Second Wife: Cynthia Conner
After the Civil War, in 1866, at the age of 41, Andrew’s first wife dies, leaving him a widower with 7 young children (the youngest being 1 year-old and the oldest being 16).
Several months later, on Jan 1, 1867, he married Cynthia Conner, a local midwife and daughter of Allen Conner and Mary Polly Crawford.
According to Helen M. Lu’s, Bill’s Creek Baptist Church: Two Hundred Year History, the new Bill’s Creek Baptist Church was built upon land owned by Issac Conner, Cynthia’s uncle.
Andrew Logan and Cynthia Conner had 6 children together: David Andrew, Linnie, Easter, Noah M., George Washington, and Allen “Andy” Peter.
Noah M. Vess, son of Andrew Logan Vess and Cynthia Conner (1875-1958) [Ancestry.com]
Andrew, like his father, was a farmer. Census records show, that Andrew and his family eventually settled in Broad River (now McDowell County) near Old Fort.
The 1900 census record reveals that he owned a farm; however, it is difficult to determine the location of his farm. It is also not known as to whether or not, he inherited his father’s property on Cedar Creek. [Information about his homesite has been shared in the comments below]
Troubles At Church
The book, Bill’s Creek Baptist Church: Two Hundred Year History, by Helen M. Lu, has been a great resource for information pertaining to the Bill’s Creek community, especially, information regarding Andrew Logan Vess.
The following are some interesting accounts mentioned in Lu’s book:
Case of Brother Andrew L. Vess “On 6 April 1862, he objected to himself on “account of drinking too much spiritous liquors.” After relating his conviction for the sin of intoxication he promised “to drink no more only as medicine.”
Bill’s Creek Baptist Church : Two Hundred Year History, by Helen M. Lu (page 109)
Excluded “Vess, A. L. Excluded 4 Jan. 1867 for distilling some brandy for the purpose of paying debts and providing for his family.”
Bill’s Creek Baptist Church : Two Hundred Year History, by Helen M. Lu (page 153)
Interestingly, a few days before he was excluded, he married Cynthia Conner.
Excluded “A. L. Vess Excluded 4 Oct. 1877 for joining Free-will Baptist.”
Bill’s Creek Baptist Church : Two Hundred Year History, by Helen M. Lu (page 189)
According to Lu, he re-joined Bill’s Creek in 1874 and 1893, “by recantation.”
Death: Old Fort, North Carolina
Davistown Cemetery Findagrave.com Gravestone only displays his birthdate; likely, because it is not the original gravestone and date of death on the original gravestone was likely illegible.
Andrew Logan Vess died on June 10, 1905, in Old Fort, McDowell County, North Carolina. He is buried at Davistown Cemetery, next to Davistown Free-will Baptist Church. According to family, the cemetery used to be the Davis Family Cemetery.
Ancestry.com
We know that Andrew Logan Vess left Bill’s Creek Baptist Church for a Free-will Baptist church, but that church was not named on record. Perhaps, it was Davistown Free Will Baptist, but there doesn’t seem to be any available information about when Davistown Free-will Baptist Church was initially formed.
Citations: Bill’s Creek Baptist Church: Two Hundred Year History 1782-1982, by Helen M. Lu.
There are many different VESS family lines today, many of which that have descended from Peter and Nathan Vess of North Carolina; however, there are actually a few unrelated families with similar surnames that, at one point or another, diverted from their original family tree with the Vess name (such as the Vest family).
The ultimate challenge in Vess Genealogy is trying to trace Vess lines accurately back to their original families.
A while ago, I stumbled on a Greenwood, South Carolina record with the name “John Vess.” Unfortunately, the document is not dated. By the looks of it, (I am certainly no expert), I would say it was probably created sometime in the 1800’s; which leaves us to ponder…who was living in South Carolina in the 1800’s?
To figure out who this John Vess might be, we first need to date the document.
Unfortunately, I am not entirely familiar with the history, districts, or residents of South Carolina. Like, North Carolina, counties and districts were frequently changing during the 1800’s, scattering records across several different areas creating some research challenges.
However, according to some recent research, Greenwood was named after a plantation in 1824. In 1897 Greenwood County was established, which was previously part of Abbeville and Edgefield, far from the Bellew and Gosnell families in Glassy Mountain, Greenville, South Carolina who are connected with Nathaniel Vess.
According to the document, the residents referred to Greenwood as a “village” that consisted of “32 families” from the Abbeville District; in which makes this document a bit older than 1824, but probably not quite as old as 1900.
Possibly Created Between 1843-1860
Today, with an approximate range of dates, I was able to find the residents named on the Greenwood document on a single record: The 1850 South Carolina, Abbeville, Greenwood census record.
Interestingly, I found nearly all the residents, except one or two, including John Vess. I found him on a different census: The 1850 South Carolina, Abbeville, Saluda census record.
Saluda and Greenwood are next to each other. They will both eventually become their own county, but at this time, they are part of Abbeville County.
The undated Greenwood document was likely created between 1843 and 1860.
According to the 1850 census, some of the residents named on the Greenwood document are in their twenties, so we can probably, safely assume, the Greenwood document was created sometime after 1843. Many of the other residents are over 50 and are missing on the 1860 census (including John Vess), suggesting the document could not have been created after 1860. So, this gives us a pretty good date range to research a local Vess family in the Greenwood area.
About John Vess of Saluda, SC
Looking at the Greenwood document, named is John Turner and John Vess. I found John Turner (30 years-old) on the 1850 Abbeville, Greenwood, South Carolina census. But, there is no John Vess on that census.
As previously mentioned, John Vess (25 years-old) is on the 1850 Abbeville, Saluda, South Carolina census record. He is listed living with an Alexander Turner.
This is the only census record I can find for this John Vess. He was born in 1825, in South Carolina. He married Drucilla Turner, daughter of Alexander Turner. According to the 1850 census record, they married within the year.
According to the 1860 census record, Drucilla Turner (Vess) is without John Vess, but she has a 7-year-old son named James Vess. She is living with her father, Alexander Turner.
I also discovered another VESSrecord, who appear to be two brothers named William E Vess (22) and John Vess (24), both carpenters, born in North Carolina, living with a Brooks family in Abbeville, Saluda Regiment (Edgefield), South Carolina. They are approximately around the same age as the John Vess found living with Alexander Turner, yet born in different states. I do not know what to make of this…
The ages of William and John would make them possible children of Peter and Nathaniel Vess; however, all their children can be found living in North Carolina.
According to the 1850 census records, Nathan (Nathaniel) and his family are living in Buncombe County, North Carolina. All except his oldest son, Andrew Jackson, who is living in Haywood County with his in-laws, Parmer.
Peter’s children are living with their mother, Catherine, in Bill’s Creek, Rutherford County, North Carolina. All except for his son, Andrew Logan, who is living in Montford Cove, Rutherford County, North Carolina with his in-laws, Halford.
Pondering Possible Relations
At first, I thought John Vess (married to Drucilla Turner) was the son of Peter Vess, for that an 1854 newspaper clipping (Petition for Divorce) states his son was no longer a resident of North Carolina. But, we find him on the 1850 census record, with his wife Elizabeth and their children, living in Bills Creek, Rutherford County, North Carolina with his mother and siblings. Unless, he moved in between census, he is unlikely to be Peter’s son. Also, all of Peter’s children were born in Rutherford County, North Carolina.
Although there is some debate on whether or not Nathan’s older children were born in South Carolina, all of his known children can also be found in North Carolina in 1850.
Perhaps, this John Vess is the son of Jonathan Vess, the so-called brother of Peter and Nathan Vess, which we know so little about.
As for the brothers, William and John Vess, born in North Carolina; I strongly suspect they are likely related to the VEST family, because of their trade. The Vest family of North Carolina appears to be well educated and the son of William “Tunwell” Vest, Charles Vest, was a manufacture (construction trade). It would only make sense that his sons or even nephews would take on a similar trade. Whereas Peter and Nathan Vess are farmers.
But there are other possibilities too, due to name changes. These Vess families could also be related to the West, Wiss, or even Voss families of South Carolina. Further research is certainly needed.
At the age of 38, on Sept. 1, 1863, Andrew Logan Vess joined the military. He served as a Confederate solider (private rank) under the 62nd Regiment, North Carolina Infantry, Company F. 
