Willis Vess

Vess Genealogy: South Carolina Connections

/ J. V.

Research strongly suggests that Peter, Willis, and Nathan Vess may have common connections in South Carolina. In this post, we begin to explore these possible connections.

Please note that the opinions and thoughts in this post are based on my own personal point of view researching these families. Links to sources are provided to allow the reader / researcher to form their own opinions, thoughts, and conclusions.

Mapping Out Families

Using information obtained by South Carolina Digital Records, I was able to map a few families that may have connections with our earliest known ancestors: Pool, Pettit, Bellew, and Willis families.
*Toney and Nicholl records have also been found, but are not mapped above.

  • Pool and Pettit families lived along the Pacelot River below Lawson’s Fork.
  • Bellew and Willis families lived along Fair Forest Creek.
  • Vice and Hembree families lived along Cain Creek branching out from the Tyger River.

Peter Vess: Pettit & Toney Families

According to Peter’s 1820 census record, he is listed next to David Mooney, Henry Pettit, James Young, and Abraham Toney. The Pettit and Toney families married each other and were members of Bill’s Creek Baptist Church with Peter Vess. [Bill’s Creek Baptist Church: Two Hundred Year History, by Helen M. Lu].

According to North Carolina’s Land grants and deed website and various other sources, David Mooney’s family has been in this area of North Carolina since the 1760’s (Tryon County), having traveled with the Eacker family. Living nearby in Lincoln County, North Carolina is the Boston Best and Charles Gosnell family. Boston Best has early land records in Tryon County, but I not sure if those properties are in modern-day North Carolina or South Carolina.

Interestingly, Boston Best (I believe to be Jr.) is on the 1790 Spartanburg County, South Carolina census record [below] near Henry Pettit, while his father Boston Best Sr. is listed next to Charles Gosnell in the 1790 Lincoln County, North Carolina census record. Charles Gosnell’s son, Joshua Gosnell, is listed next to Abraham Belue (Bellew) on the 1790 Spartanburg County, South Carolina census record – a few pages over from Henry Pettit.

Also, John Vice/Vise is on the same page of the 1790 Spartanburg County, South Carolina census record as Henry Pettit, but listed as John “Wise.” We can safely assume John “Wise” is John Vice, based on other families on the same page, such as Joel Hembree (Embry) who is a neighbor of John Vice per land records.

We know the Toney family was also in South Carolina. They appear to have been in South Carolina as early as the Revolutionary War (like Henry Pettit). I found a Toney family with a land record in Tyger River dated the same year that John Vice obtained land in the Tyger River area too [below].

According to family trees for the Toney family, Abraham Toney of Rutherford County, North Carolina (with Peter Vess) is supposedly related to Timothy Toney of South Carolina. There are numerous Abraham’s on the family tree and 2 of them went by William (Abraham William Toney) which has caused a lot of confusion, so further research is needed to confirm the two Toney families are related.


Also, I see John Stovall next to Henry Pettit on the 1790 census.
I believe Ann Pool, Henry’s wife, is related to the Stovall family (her maternal line) and the Stovall family had connections with the prominent PENN and HAIRSTON families in Patrick County, Virginia where we find William and Peter Vess [1790-1801 Patrick County Deeds].

Dunneway is also an interesting name on the 1790 census [above]. There is a marriage record for Nathaniel Vice and Sarah Dunaway in Kentucky (1802). This is supposedly Nathaniel Vice Jr., brother of John Vice Sr. in South Carolina. There appears to be confusion over the numerous Nathaniels in the Vice family tree, so it is not certain how they are actually connected, further research is needed.

According to the Vice family trees, Nathaniel and John Vice are brothers…do they, perhaps have a brother named Peter? And, would this Peter have been the Peter from Patrick County, Virginia? If the VICE and VESS families are the same family, is this where our oral tradition about the three brothers: Peter, John, and Nathaniel come from?

Nathan Vess: Bellew & Gosnell Families

Nathan’s wife, Clarinda Bellew is supposedly a descendant of the Gosnell/Bellew families of the Dark Corners of South Carolina (Glassy Mountain, Greenville Co. SC) with her father being John Bellew and her mother being Clarinda Gosnell.

We can find Nathan Vess and John Bellew on the 1830 Rutherford County, North Carolina census record.

On the 1790 Spartanburg County, South Carolina census record [below], we have Joshua Gosnell (son of Charles Gosnell of Lincoln County, NC) and Abraham Bellew, who is supposedly Clarinda Bellew’s grandfather.


There are numerous records for the Bellew (Belue, Bellew) family in South Carolina, prior to them settling in Glassy Mountain, Greenville County. One record of interest, is a 1774 record for Abraham Belue on Dutchmans Creek along Tyger River [below]. This is dated much earlier than the Vice family; however, Pruitt is a name that appears to be connected to the Pettit and Vice families. Of course, further investigation is needed here too.


Coincidence or Fact: Mac-Hugh Story

According to one of our family’s oral traditions about an O’Donnell-Vess, the Vess family supposedly came over with an O’Neil and an O’Donnell family from Ireland. O’Neill, wanted by the English Crown, supposedly changed his name to Mac Hugh (for his red hair) and was highly respected by the Vess family.

This oral tradition is said to have been very important to the Vess family (descendants of David Andrew Vess and Magnolia Gosnell). Upon further investigation, I found that this story appears to be similar to 2 actual historical events: The O’Donnell and O’Neil clans from Northern Ireland (1500’s) and the infamous outlaw of South Carolina’s Dark Corners, Lewis Redmond.

Knowing more about the Dark Corners of South Carolina and its residents, it is extremely interesting a William “Readmond” and Thomas “Neal”are listed next to the Gosnell and Bellew families on the 1790 Spartanburg County, South Carolina census [above]; especially, since the Gosnell and Bellew families settled in Greenville County, South Carolina, in an area where Lewis Redmond will become a well-respected outlaw. Is he a descendant of William Readmond and were the Bellew, Gosnell, and Vess families connected to the Readmond and Neil families?

Willis Vess: Willis, Ligon, and Other Families

Willis Vess was supposedly born in 1810 in North Carolina, but records of him do not appear until 1830 in Franklin County, Alabama. Interestingly, sources say some of the Vice families migrated to Alabama and there is a document on Ancestry.com that was posted in 2011, stating John Roebuck Vise Sr. and Martha Pruitt having had a child named Willis born in 1810. Unfortunately, this does not confirm Willis Vise and Willis Vess are the same person. But, perhaps there is a connection…

The oldest children of Willis Vess and Talitha Whitlock married into the John Willis family who are shown to be neighbors in Foxtrap, Franklin County, Alabama [below].

Looking at South Carolina records, I came across the Ligon name (Robert Ligon) on a land record for John Pool [below]. Note: Pool, Rogers and Meadows have connections with the Vice family.

Then, looking at the Franklin Co. Alabama plat map [below], there in the Foxtrap area with Willis Vess and John Willis, is listed James and Abner Ligon. Further research states that James and Abner Ligon are the sons of Robert Ligon in South Carolina. Also, James Dubois is a family that was in Foxtrap as early as 1820, possibly one of the earlier settlers of the area and Dubois is also a name found in early records of Tyger River community in South Carolina.

Below is another interesting record.
Here we find the Nicholls family (also found in Franklin County, Alabama) on a land record with the following families: Meadows (married Nathaniel Vice)
Pettit (married Mary Vice)
Rogers (neighbors of John Vice)
Willis (maybe related to John Willis)

So, I can’t help but wonder: Could Willis Vess be related to the Vice family of South Carolina? And, could John Willis, neighbors of Willis Vess, be related to Richard Willis?

So many interesting discoveries and still so many more questions; but it appears that South Carolina may be the key to unraveling the mysteries of the Vess family!

Vess/Vest Family Of White County, Tennessee

/ J. V. / 1 Comment

While investigating Willis Vess, I may have found my way back to the Patrick County, VA Vess/Vest family!

My game plan to try to uncover the origins of the Alabama Vess family include looking at maps, neighbors, spouses, genealogy records (census, land, probate, etc), and the history of Alabama.

Investigating Land Records

Franklin County, Alabama was first established in 1818, before Alabama became a state (December 14, 1819). Records of early settlers of northern portions of Alabama may be found in the Mississippi Territory records. Unfortunately, I haven’t found any records of interest.

The earliest record I’ve found on Willis Vess is an 1830 census record for Franklin County, Alabama. However, he is listed as being between the ages of 30-40, living with two females between the ages of 15-30. This does not appear to match the timeline reported on family trees. Also, he is 10 years younger in the 1840 census (listed as being between the ages of 20-30). Census records are notorious for their mistakes.

Interestingly, on the 1830 census record, I do recognize two familiar family names next to Willis Vess: SUGG and THARP.

Willis Vess lived near both of them and the Sugg family has records as early as 1819. In fact, despite the 1820 Alabama census record being supposedly incomplete, it does contain some families from the Foxtrap area [THARP, SUGG, MATLOCK, THOMPSON, and DEBOIS].

Littleberry Matlock is shown on the Alabama Genweb plat map, living next to Willis Vess. Further research reveals that he married Phoebe Tharp whose father is Robert Tharp (1820 census above) and supposedly (not confirmed yet) her mother is a Thompson from Rutherford County, North Carolina. Interesting!

After 1830, we believe Willis Vess married Talitha Whitlock; unfortunately, I have not been able to find a marriage record. However, we do know a lot about the Whitlock family due to extensive research by Anna Popejoy and published works by the Whitlock Newsletter via Google. The Whitlock family arrived in Alabama in 1820 and lived in an area referred to as Saints cross (which is near Foxtrap). I figure this may be how Willis Vess and Talitha Whitlock met each other.

The oldest children of Willis and Talitha Vess married into the Willis family, which may suggest the Vess and Willis families were close (they were close neighbors shown on the map below) and it is believed that the Willis family may have connections with the parents of Willis Vess (no evidence yet).

I do not know when the Willis family arrived in Franklin Alabama, however, both John Willis and Willis Vess appear on the 1830 census record (several pages apart).

Looking at the President’s name on their undated land records for Franklin County, Alabama, it appears that John Willis purchased land near the Foxtrap area before Willis Vess. John Willis’ record [No. 5972] was signed by Andrew Jackson who was President between 1829-1837 and Willis Vess’ record [No. 8737] was signed by Martin Van Buren who was President between 1837-1841.

The map below (looking at surrounding families) seem to have been something that was put together sometime after the 1850’s. The earliest known neighbor near Willis Vess is James Dubois [No. 8705, also issued in 1837] who is seen on the 1820 census record (above). The land record for John Willis signed by Present Andrew Jackson is not dated, but was likely issued between 1829-1837 and land records No. 19711 and 19712 was signed between 1857-1861 when James Buchanan was President. Unfortunately, nothing seems to reveal any clues about the Vess family prior to 1830.

Willis Vess appears to have owned several properties in the Foxtrap area.

I found 3 land records for Willis Vess:
No. 8737 August 5, 1837
No. 20457 & 20252 April 2, 1857 *No. 20451 & 20452 on map (above)
No. 25798 March 1, 1858 (William Vess as heir) *No. 25797 on map (above)


Who is William Vess?
None of the family trees I have come across for Willis Vess have a William Vess on them, so I am not entirely sure who he is; however, it certainly makes my next discovery extremely intriguing…

1846 Tennessee Record: Peter, Willis, William Vess/ Vest

There is one Willis Vess record that intrigues me the most and it is a land record for White County, Tennessee (1846) on Caney Fork.

Is this Willis Vess of Alabama?

Tennessee Virtual Archives

Willis Vess of White County, Tennessee, appears to have 2 land records for a property on Caney Fork:
No. 2012 dated 1831
No. 9156 (addition to No. 2012) dated 1849

The property interestingly joins Daniel Dotson (Dodson).

Looking at census records, I do not see a Willis Vess; however, there is an 1820 and 1830 census record for Peter Vest, whose neighbor is Daniel Dotson (Dodson).

In addition, there is also a William Vess. He also purchases land in 1831 No. 2071, whose property takes over land once owned by John Medley (see 1820 census above). William Dodson and Sam Moore are witnesses listed on the record. William Vess can be found on the 1830 census record. Is this William Vess, the William Vess who is “heir” to the Willis Vess of Alabama’s 1858 land record in Franklin County, Alabama??

And, furthermore, is this Peter Vest, the same Peter Vest listed on the Patrick Co. Deeds (1791-1941 Indexes, grantor pg. 77 on FHL Film 33,333) with wife “Margaret,” who appears to have land next to the Dodson family on North Fork in Patrick County, Virginia? A 1793 transaction which was witnessed by George Dodson Sr., George Dodson Junior, Benjamin Fletcher, and Thomas Dodson.

Perhaps, it is Peter and William Vess of Patrick County, Virginia (Deed Records) on North Fork with William Willis??

Is there an actual connection or is this just coincidence?

Conclusions

Wow!

A Franklin County, Alabama land record for Willis Vess and “heir” William Vess.
A Willis and William Vess in White County, Tennessee, with a Peter Vest.
All near a Dodson family.
And… interestingly, there is a Peter Vess and William Vess in Patrick County, Virginia, not only living next to a Dodson family, but ALSO a Willis family.

I don’t have enough documented evidence to make any solid connections, but I am absolutely intrigued!

Tennessee is a mixing pot of Vest, Voss, Vaulx, and Vess families! Hopefully, with more research, we can determine which family the Vess/Vest family of White County, Tennessee belongs to!














Vess Genealogy: A New Chapter

/ J. V.

I am so thrilled to have finally reached a new chapter in Vess Genealogy!

When I started this blog last Fall (August 2020), it was simply just a place to organize digital sources and share my genealogy experiences researching the Vess name. I gave it 2 months!

Remarkably, Vess Genealogy kept on going! I never would have ever imagined I would get to work with so many different people interested in the VESS name nor get an opportunity to meet so many different VESS families! This has been such an amazing genealogy adventure!

A HUGE THANK YOU to everyone helping me unravel the mysteries of the VESS family!

If New To Vess Genealogy, Here’s What You Missed!

For generations, three different VESS lines (maybe more) haven’t been able find their ancestors prior to 1820. A frustrating endeavor leaving many of us to just give up.

However, since last Fall, we achieved the following:

1. We learned more about Peter Vess and his family.
2. We learned a lot about Andrew Logan Vess and his family.
3. We likely uncovered Nathan’s origins in the Dark Corners of South Carolina.
4. We discovered that Peter and Willis Vess are closely related and that our family is closely related to the Travers family!
5. We explored families in Knob’s Creek from Peter’s 1820 census record.
6. We discovered “Vess” records in Virginia connected to an unknown Vest/Vess family!
8. We confirmed (via DNA) that the VESS family is not related to the BASS, BEST, WEST, or VEST families; eliminating them as possible family connections.

Brief Recap On Vess Genealogy

We now know that Peter, Willis, and Nathan Vess are related; however, we have not yet determined how they are related to each other.

Peter and Willis were born in North Carolina and Nathan was born in South Carolina. Peter first appears on record in Rutherford County, North Carolina in 1820 on Knobs Creek with the Toney, Pettit, and Mooney families (all members of Bill’s Creek Baptist Church).

Nathan’s first appearance on record is also in Rutherford County, North Carolina, but in 1830 with his in-laws, the Bellew family. The Bellew and Gosnell families are related and are prominent families in Glassy Mountain, Greenville County, South Carolina (aka Dark Corners). Also, Peter’s grandson, David Andrew Vess married Magnolia “Maggie” Gosnell, who is related to Nathan’s wife, Clarinda Bellew.

Willis first appears on record in Franklin County, Alabama in 1830. According to Anna Popejoy, long time researcher of the Vess and Whitlock families, states that the father of Willis Vess (John Vess) had been living in Foxtrap since 1819. Y-DNA analysis, via familytreedna.com, confirms Willis Vess and Peter Vess (Andrew Logan Vess) are definitely part of the same VESS family.

Familytreedna.com (FTDNA) also shows that the VESS and TRAVERS family are closely related; however, we do not know how they are related. There are several reasons as to why FTDNA may group two different surnames closely together; either we are extremely close cousins, one family that split apart during a time before surnames, or a male Travers ancestor took on the Vess name (or vice versa). To unravel this mystery, it would be extremely helpful to have more male Vess descendants participate in Y-DNA Testing.

The Travers family is from Lancashire, England and they have traced their family to Dorchester, Maryland. Whether there is a connection between the Vess and Travers family in Colonial America has yet to be discovered (the families may have split long before they arrived in America).

With the help of Y-DNA and documented family histories, we’ve been able to eliminate the BASS, BEST, WEST, and VEST families as potential ancestors for the Vess family.

The BASS family has a rich Native American background. The BEST family (original surname BOSCH) can trace their family back to their arrival in the 1740’s with the Ecker family (in-laws) from Germany. The WEST family has been ruled out by their extensive West Family DNA Project. And the VEST family, descendants of John Daniel Vest belong to an entirely different Haplogroup than our VESS family. To my knowledge, there is no available DNA information on the VASS/VOSS/ VAULX families.

We have recently discovered a VEST/VESS family in Patrick County, Virginia who may be related to the VEST/VESS family in Rockbridge, Virginia. We have yet to find any records suggesting that they may belong to the VEST family (John Daniel Vest), which is extremely encouraging for our VESS family, and therefore a new chapter begins!

I am in the process of investigating the Life of Willis Vess and hopefully, with any luck, we can uncover some of Anna Popejoy’s research to help us! I plan to explore more families in and surrounding Patrick County, Virginia – including Surry and Stokes County, North Carolina. All in addition to finding out more about the VOSS/VASS/ VAULX families who seem to live very close to the TRAVERS family in both Dorchester, Maryland and the abolished Albemarle County in North Carolina.

Familytreedna.com
not an affiliated link










Investigating Willis Vess of Alabama: A Stumbling Start

/ J. V. / 2 Comments

This past weekend, I began to research Willis Vess of Alabama, just as extensively as Peter Vess of North Carolina; but I immediately stumbled upon a couple of genealogy road-blocks.

First of all, early Alabama records are weird.

Locating The Vess Family

In my opinion, the best way to research early families is to pin-point where they once lived and explore every part of their community, leaving no stone unturned.

Census records tell us that Willis Vess lived in Franklin County, Alabama (1830-1860) and then in Colbert County, Alabama (1870-1880). I suspect a county change rather than a physical move; which was later confirmed by maps.


Willis Vess was a farmer who had several properties and without the assistance of maps, I would have never been able to locate his properties; let alone find them in the correct county.

His land records state “Huntsville.”

Huntsville is in Madison county, a couple of counties east of Franklin and Colbert County.

This was confusing, especially, since the description of land does not reference rivers or creeks, but instead “Huntsville” coordinates; which kind of implies the property is in Huntsville.

Did Willis Vess live in Franklin / Colbert County, but had farm land in Madison County?

Well, turns out that Huntsville was just a place that sold land. It says so, on an official land record available for Willis Vess; as if it was written in Old English by Dr. Suess!

Image below reads: “the North West quarter of the North East quarter of Section two in Township six of Range seven West, in the District of Lands Subject to Sale at Huntsville Alabama, certifying forty acres and four hundredths of an acre.”

Or so, that is what I think it reads. I had to read it several times, before finally comprehending what it really says!

But yeah, the “district of lands subject to sale at Huntsville Alabama,” means Willis Vess purchased his land (located in Franklin County) through the Huntsville land-office in Madison County. And note, the only reference to “Franklin County” on this record, is its greeting to “Willis Vess of Franklin County, Alabama.”

And we wonder why so many records get lost!

Fox Trap Creek


If there are no creeks or rivers to reference, where does one start to look?

Fortunately, I got a hint from FindAGrave.com (of all places).
If you look at the memorial for John Vess, father of Willis Vess, created by Anna Popejoy (long-time researcher), it states:

“Mr John Vess was in Foxtrap by 1818. He built a Log Cabin in 1819/20. Cabin is still standing.”

I scoured the Internet. I didn’t know if Foxtrap was a community, creek, river, town, fort, plantation, mountain- or just some special spot only known to locals.

Surprisingly, I found Foxtrap on Google maps, by searching around Mountain Star (per sources on Ancestry.com). It is a creek that starts in Colbert County and extends downward into Franklin County, crossing Mountain Star Rd; which accurately reflects the county change seen in the census records for Willis Vess.


Interestingly, there are a few creeks named after early families surrounding Mountain Star; most notably: DODSON Branch and WHITLOCK Branch.

And for a good chuckle, there is also Rock Creek, Mud Creek, & Spring Creek (I assume these particular creeks had rocks, mud, and a spring) and then there is also Stinking Bear Creek which I would love to hear the story behind that one!

Then, after I spent an hour doing it the hard way….I found this on Alabama Genweb (Land Patent Mapping)! It has everyone!

This is a great resource to help me research neighbors (like I did with Peter and Nathan VESS), but I wish it had a date on it. I mean, some of these neighbors could have settled in as late as the 1880’s, which is not exactly helpful in tracing early settlers prior to 1820.

Where Did John Vess Come From

Of course this is multi-million dollar question! Where in the world did John Vess come from!

Besides an old cabin, there really isn’t any proof that John Vess ever existed – no census records or even a grave stone.

Franklin County, Alabama was established in February 1818 and according to Anna Popejoy (FindAGrave.com), this is about the time John Vess arrived to Foxtrap and according to Whitlock sources, it wasn’t until the 1820’s that the Whitlock family arrived from Georgia with the Thompson and Pennington families.

Looking at old maps between 1810-1820, it’s all Indian territory (including the western parts of Tennessee directly above Alabama).

One doesn’t just pack up their entire family and head 400+ miles for Indian territory alone; so there is a really good chance the Vess family didn’t travel alone. And, the safest route (I can think of) from North Carolina to Foxtrap Creek in Alabama would have probably been to go through territory already owned by the United States: South Carolina, Georgia, then Alabama.

So instead of traveling through Tennessee, John might have gone down through Rutherford County, North Carolina (Willis family) into Greenville County, South Carolina (Bellew and Gosnell family), through Georgia (Whitlock family), and straight across into Madison County (Huntsville) and finally settling in Foxtrap.

Of course, that is just a theory; one that might change if we find evidence of a connection with the VEST family who seem to have migrated into Tennessee, Kentucky, and Ohio.

The 1820 Census Blunder


If John Vess was living in Foxtrap since 1818, why is he not found on the 1820 census?
Was he so remote he got missed?

I guess I am not the only one who noticed, because apparently there is a very good chance he was missed!

According to an article posted on AL.com, there was a “mortifying miscount of the 1820 census,” where census workers supposedly quit during the census-taking process!

I don’t think any of the families in the Mountain Star area had been counted, because I do not recognize any of the names on the 1820 census for Franklin County, Alabama. There are no Whitlock, Dodson, Orr, Willis, Smith, Vandiver, or Isabell families listed on the census, but maybe they hadn’t arrived yet.

However, I still do not think the VESS family was alone.

Courthouse Fire

Not only do we have an incomplete census (when we really need one), but Franklin County also had a court house fire (in 1890). Who knows what records were lost (perhaps missing census tallies).

A Quick Recap Of What We Know

Despite such a stumbling start, we have learned quite a bit!

With DNA testing, we now know that Willis Vess of Alabama and Andrew Logan Vess of Rutherford County, North Carolina are closely related; but we have yet to figure out where they connect on the family tree.

Willis Vess appeared on record as early as 1837 (land record). He was a farmer who lived around Mountain Star along Foxtrap Creek in Colbert County, Alabama (once Franklin County). He married Talitha Whitlock, whose family arrived sometime during the 1820’s with the Thompson and Pennington families.

Records are scarce due to a census fail in 1820 and a courthouse fire in 1890.

Fortunately, we have a bunch of other resources to explore!

We have a map of neighbors, which means, we can explore records of close neighbors. We might also be able to locate the first settlers who may have traveled to Alabama with John Vess.

We also have the Mississippi Territory census record of 1816 to explore, which covered parts of Alabama before Alabama became a state! It really depends on when and where John Vess arrived in Alabama (via Tennessee or Georgia).

I really look forward to learning more about the VESS family of Alabama!