Vess genealogy

John Vice: The Missing Link To Vess Genealogy?

/ J. V.

Although the VESS/VEST family of Patrick County, Virginia (1790-1801) are extremely intriguing and seem like a promising connection, I am drawn back to the Dark Corners of South Carolina. I decided to take another look at Peter, Willis, and Nathan Vess. Looking at all my research, I have come to realize that the early families surrounding them, all came from South Carolina.

Peter: Pettit and Toney families.
Willis: Nichols, Willis, Askews, Whitlock families (many more)
Nathan: Bellew and Gosnell families

Of course, these families all have different origin-origins, like the Pettit family come from New Jersey, the Gosnell family come from Maryland, and the Nichols, Willis, Askews (Eskews) and Whitlock families come from Virginia; but all of them, just before they appear with our earliest known Vess ancestors (Peter, Willis, and Nathan) … were all in South Carolina; more specifically, the Tyger River area.

Tyger River Area: South Carolina’s Complicated Borders

The western portion of South Carolina has a complicated history with very messy borders, making it a nightmare to find family records. For instance, between 1769-1779, Tryon County, North Carolina and the Ninety-Six District in South Carolina overlap. Some residents in this area were issued land from the State of North Carolina while others were issued land from the state of South Carolina.

The Vice Family

I’ve looked for families with similar surnames to VESS in South Carolina a zillion times, but apparently, I overlooked the VICE family.

On the 1810 census record for Spartanburg County, South Carolina, I found a John Vice next to Nancy Poole. Nancy Poole reminds me of Nancy Pool, sister of Mary Ann Pool, who married Henry Pettit Sr (neighbor and member of Bill’s Creek Baptist Church with Peter Vess).

So, I searched the name “John Vice” in the South Carolina Digital Archives.
One record of interest is a land record dated 1824 for Benjamin Nicholls on Thomsons Branch along the Tyger River. It includes familiar families such as Duncan, Moore, Nicholls, Pettit, and Willis.

Clearly intrigued, I began to research further…

Many early families are well documented by family historians and generally, with a few odd-ball keywords, a good chunk of their history can be found via Google. I was fortunate to find information pertaining to the VICE family on a Turley Family website.

Who Is John Vice

Land records show that the Vice family has been in the Tyger River community as early as 1782 and numerous sources say some members of the Vice family moved to Benton (now Calhoun) county, Alabama.

Research tells us that John Vice was born in Orange County, Virginia about 1755 and died in Spartanburg County, South Carolina in 1833. He is the son of Nathaniel Camp Vice (1730-1802) of Frederick County, Virginia.

Nathaniel Camp Vice is supposedly the son of Robert or John VESSEY of Frederick County, Virginia; however, the origins of VESSEY are not clear. Nathaniel Camp Vice migrated south and settled in Campbell County, Kentucky with many of his descendants rooting in Bath County, Kentucky.

Nathaniel’s son, John Vice (some note his name as John William Vice), married Frances Roebuck in 1773 in Chatham County, North Carolina, before settling in Spartanburg County, South Carolina. According to the Turley Family website, they had 10 children:

John Roebuck Vise abt. 1774

Nathaniel Vise abt. 1774 and married Dorcas MEADERS. (Meadows?)

Rhoda Vise abt. 1776 and married Peter LAWRENCE.

Levi Vise abt. 1778

George Vise  abt. 1780 and married Elizabeth WALKER.

Reuben Vise  1782

Eliphous Hosea “Eli” Vise abt. 1785 and married Rebecca MEADERS. (Meadows?)

Elizabeth Vise 1787 in Spartanburg , SC and married Thomas WRIGHT.

Azariah “Zery” Vise  abt. 1790

Jeremiah “Jere” Vise about 1790

Abner Vise about 1792 and married Lucinda PREWITT.

Jemima Vise about 1792

A Tyger River Baptist Church Connection


The Turley family website states: “John Vise and Frances Roebuck Vise were members of the Tyger River Baptist Church, also called Friendship Church. On the membership roll for 1801-1803…” 

This is an incredible find, for that the Tyger River Baptist Church was part of the same church association as Bill’s Creek Baptist Church. We also know that the Pettit family were also members of the Tyger River Baptist Church.

According to history.ky.gov, the location of the Tyger River Baptist Church is unknown however is said to have been located in the northern portion of Greenville County, close to the North Carolina border. This would ideally put the church very close to the Glassy Mountain community and the communities along the Pacelot River (North and South Carolina border in modern day Polk County) where we find many early families from Tryon County (like the Logan family).

I bet there are a lot of interesting families listed as members on the Tyger River Baptist Church Membership Rolls; unfortunately, these records do not appear to be available online nor are they physically available near me.

Census Records: Spartanburg County, South Carolina

On the 1790 census record for Spartanburg County, South Carolina, you will find the following families:
1. Boston Best
2. Henry Pattit (Pettit)
3. Joshua Pattit (Pettit)
4. John Wice (Vice)

A few pages over, you will find the following families:
1. Abraham Belue (Bellew)
2. Joshua Gosnell

*The Bise families on the 1790 census might actually be part of the Vise family.

On the 1800 census record for Spartanburg County, South Carolina, you will find the following families interestingly close together:
Nat Vice (Nathaniel Vice, John Vice son)
John Willis
Richard Willis (find him on land records with Vice family)


DNA Connections

Autosomal DNA Results
For me, many of the names on the VICE family tree frequently show up in my DNA relatives list, especially via the Turley, McPherson, and White families.

Even more interestingly, I have a long list of distant DNA relatives with family trees showing them as descendants of the VICE family and not just through one VICE family line, but numerous VICE family lines. Most are via John and Nathaniel Vice (sons of John and France Roebuck Vice of South Carolina) and others are from several different descending lines (sons and daughters) from Nathaniel Camp Vice in Kentucky. And, to make it even more interesting, they share DNA relatives with DNA relatives who are descendants on the Willis Vess line.

Pettit – Vice Connection
The granddaughter of John Vice married Benjamin Pettit who is related to Henry Pettit Sr. (neighbor and member of Bill’s Creek Baptist Church with Peter Vess) through Joshua Pettit.

John Vice and Henry Pettit have a common neighbor: Andrew Thomson. *Correction: Andrew Thomson maybe the surveyor.
1. 1784 land record: Pacelot River / Ninety-six District Henry Pettit, William Pool, and Andrew Thomson
2. 1786 land record: Tyger River / Ninety-six District John Vise, Andrew Thomson, John Oshields, Joel Hembree, David Grimes, John Butler *Pettit and Hembree families are related.

The Next Chapter: Vice Family

I am really excited about discovering the Vice family! Not only do they have a similar surname to VESS, but they are also in the right place at the right time, surrounded by many familiar families that connect with Peter, Willis, and Nathan!

Also, because the Vice family is supposedly from Frederick County, Virginia, there is still a chance for a possible connection with the Vess/Vest family in Patrick County, Virginia!

So, I am extremely excited!! This could be our family’s missing link OR I am embarking upon another goose-chase!












Vess/Vest Family Of White County, Tennessee

/ J. V. / 1 Comment

While investigating Willis Vess, I may have found my way back to the Patrick County, VA Vess/Vest family!

My game plan to try to uncover the origins of the Alabama Vess family include looking at maps, neighbors, spouses, genealogy records (census, land, probate, etc), and the history of Alabama.

Investigating Land Records

Franklin County, Alabama was first established in 1818, before Alabama became a state (December 14, 1819). Records of early settlers of northern portions of Alabama may be found in the Mississippi Territory records. Unfortunately, I haven’t found any records of interest.

The earliest record I’ve found on Willis Vess is an 1830 census record for Franklin County, Alabama. However, he is listed as being between the ages of 30-40, living with two females between the ages of 15-30. This does not appear to match the timeline reported on family trees. Also, he is 10 years younger in the 1840 census (listed as being between the ages of 20-30). Census records are notorious for their mistakes.

Interestingly, on the 1830 census record, I do recognize two familiar family names next to Willis Vess: SUGG and THARP.

Willis Vess lived near both of them and the Sugg family has records as early as 1819. In fact, despite the 1820 Alabama census record being supposedly incomplete, it does contain some families from the Foxtrap area [THARP, SUGG, MATLOCK, THOMPSON, and DEBOIS].

Littleberry Matlock is shown on the Alabama Genweb plat map, living next to Willis Vess. Further research reveals that he married Phoebe Tharp whose father is Robert Tharp (1820 census above) and supposedly (not confirmed yet) her mother is a Thompson from Rutherford County, North Carolina. Interesting!

After 1830, we believe Willis Vess married Talitha Whitlock; unfortunately, I have not been able to find a marriage record. However, we do know a lot about the Whitlock family due to extensive research by Anna Popejoy and published works by the Whitlock Newsletter via Google. The Whitlock family arrived in Alabama in 1820 and lived in an area referred to as Saints cross (which is near Foxtrap). I figure this may be how Willis Vess and Talitha Whitlock met each other.

The oldest children of Willis and Talitha Vess married into the Willis family, which may suggest the Vess and Willis families were close (they were close neighbors shown on the map below) and it is believed that the Willis family may have connections with the parents of Willis Vess (no evidence yet).

I do not know when the Willis family arrived in Franklin Alabama, however, both John Willis and Willis Vess appear on the 1830 census record (several pages apart).

Looking at the President’s name on their undated land records for Franklin County, Alabama, it appears that John Willis purchased land near the Foxtrap area before Willis Vess. John Willis’ record [No. 5972] was signed by Andrew Jackson who was President between 1829-1837 and Willis Vess’ record [No. 8737] was signed by Martin Van Buren who was President between 1837-1841.

The map below (looking at surrounding families) seem to have been something that was put together sometime after the 1850’s. The earliest known neighbor near Willis Vess is James Dubois [No. 8705, also issued in 1837] who is seen on the 1820 census record (above). The land record for John Willis signed by Present Andrew Jackson is not dated, but was likely issued between 1829-1837 and land records No. 19711 and 19712 was signed between 1857-1861 when James Buchanan was President. Unfortunately, nothing seems to reveal any clues about the Vess family prior to 1830.

Willis Vess appears to have owned several properties in the Foxtrap area.

I found 3 land records for Willis Vess:
No. 8737 August 5, 1837
No. 20457 & 20252 April 2, 1857 *No. 20451 & 20452 on map (above)
No. 25798 March 1, 1858 (William Vess as heir) *No. 25797 on map (above)


Who is William Vess?
None of the family trees I have come across for Willis Vess have a William Vess on them, so I am not entirely sure who he is; however, it certainly makes my next discovery extremely intriguing…

1846 Tennessee Record: Peter, Willis, William Vess/ Vest

There is one Willis Vess record that intrigues me the most and it is a land record for White County, Tennessee (1846) on Caney Fork.

Is this Willis Vess of Alabama?

Tennessee Virtual Archives

Willis Vess of White County, Tennessee, appears to have 2 land records for a property on Caney Fork:
No. 2012 dated 1831
No. 9156 (addition to No. 2012) dated 1849

The property interestingly joins Daniel Dotson (Dodson).

Looking at census records, I do not see a Willis Vess; however, there is an 1820 and 1830 census record for Peter Vest, whose neighbor is Daniel Dotson (Dodson).

In addition, there is also a William Vess. He also purchases land in 1831 No. 2071, whose property takes over land once owned by John Medley (see 1820 census above). William Dodson and Sam Moore are witnesses listed on the record. William Vess can be found on the 1830 census record. Is this William Vess, the William Vess who is “heir” to the Willis Vess of Alabama’s 1858 land record in Franklin County, Alabama??

And, furthermore, is this Peter Vest, the same Peter Vest listed on the Patrick Co. Deeds (1791-1941 Indexes, grantor pg. 77 on FHL Film 33,333) with wife “Margaret,” who appears to have land next to the Dodson family on North Fork in Patrick County, Virginia? A 1793 transaction which was witnessed by George Dodson Sr., George Dodson Junior, Benjamin Fletcher, and Thomas Dodson.

Perhaps, it is Peter and William Vess of Patrick County, Virginia (Deed Records) on North Fork with William Willis??

Is there an actual connection or is this just coincidence?

Conclusions

Wow!

A Franklin County, Alabama land record for Willis Vess and “heir” William Vess.
A Willis and William Vess in White County, Tennessee, with a Peter Vest.
All near a Dodson family.
And… interestingly, there is a Peter Vess and William Vess in Patrick County, Virginia, not only living next to a Dodson family, but ALSO a Willis family.

I don’t have enough documented evidence to make any solid connections, but I am absolutely intrigued!

Tennessee is a mixing pot of Vest, Voss, Vaulx, and Vess families! Hopefully, with more research, we can determine which family the Vess/Vest family of White County, Tennessee belongs to!














Vess Family DNA Project

/ J. V. / 2 Comments

I am extremely excited to announce that we have been given the opportunity to start a VESS FAMILY DNA PROJECT!

A huge thanks to Marilyn Barton, for allowing us to revive her Vess Family DNA project on Familytreedna.com and also, a huge thanks to Michael Travers and Vincent Vess for managing it for us!

How To Join?

To join and participate, you must have an account with Familytreedna.com.

If you sign up for an account on their homepage, you will be required to buy a DNA kit. However, anyone who has already completed an autosomal test through 23andMe© or AncestryDNA™ or MyHeritage™ can sign up for an account for free by transferring their results to Familytreedna.com.

Click here to get started!
Note: You must download your Raw DNA data first (see directions below).

Downloading Raw Data File To Transfer To Familytreedna.com

Ancestry.com

23&Me.com
Visit you.23andme.com/tools/data/, which should take you directly to the Raw Data Download Page after signing into your account.


MyHeritage.com

Click on this link for step-by-step instructions from yourdnaguide.com.

How Long Does The Transfer Process Take

Familytreedna.com states it takes 3-5 business days to process, but some reviews state it could be as quick as a few hours; it all depends on how many transfers they have to process (it’s a queue system).

However, you can join the Vess Family DNA Project and explore public Haplotrees while you wait for your results to process.

$19 To Access Additional Tools

It is my understanding that a free account opened by transferring DNA results from another vendor, allows you access to FamilyFinder and DNA Projects. However, one must pay $19 to unlock additional tools such as the Chromosome Browser, MyOrigins, and AncientOrigins.

Which isn’t that bad, considering you’re not having to buy an expensive DNA kit again or pay any kind of subscription to continue to access information.

Who Can Participate?

Any member of Familytreedna.com can join the Vess Family DNA Project! It is my understanding that this DNA project is not restricted to any specific type of testers and thus, all DNA tests are able to provide valuable information to the project.

  • Information provided by Autosomal DNA testers (both genders) allow us to make new family connections.
  • Information provided by mtDNA testers allow us to explore maternal roots.
  • Information provided by Y-DNA testers allow us to identify and connect different VESS/ VOSS/VASS/ VEST family lines.
  • Information provided by Big-Y testers allow us to further investigate and unravel the mystery between the Vess and Travers families.

The more participants, the more DNA information we can obtain and analyze, and then the more connections we can make!

Transferring Y-DNA Test Results

If you have already done a Y-DNA test through a different company that used the Sorenson 33 or 46-marker test, you can transfer your results to Familytreedna.com to participate in the Y-DNA portion of the Vess Family DNA Project.

For more information on how to do it, please visit this link: Y-DNA Transfer From Another Company

DNA DAY: Tests On Sale
Now through April 26th

Please visit the Familytreedna.com for accurate pricing and more details.


Disclosure: There are no affiliated links in this post.






Vess Genealogy: A New Chapter

/ J. V.

I am so thrilled to have finally reached a new chapter in Vess Genealogy!

When I started this blog last Fall (August 2020), it was simply just a place to organize digital sources and share my genealogy experiences researching the Vess name. I gave it 2 months!

Remarkably, Vess Genealogy kept on going! I never would have ever imagined I would get to work with so many different people interested in the VESS name nor get an opportunity to meet so many different VESS families! This has been such an amazing genealogy adventure!

A HUGE THANK YOU to everyone helping me unravel the mysteries of the VESS family!

If New To Vess Genealogy, Here’s What You Missed!

For generations, three different VESS lines (maybe more) haven’t been able find their ancestors prior to 1820. A frustrating endeavor leaving many of us to just give up.

However, since last Fall, we achieved the following:

1. We learned more about Peter Vess and his family.
2. We learned a lot about Andrew Logan Vess and his family.
3. We likely uncovered Nathan’s origins in the Dark Corners of South Carolina.
4. We discovered that Peter and Willis Vess are closely related and that our family is closely related to the Travers family!
5. We explored families in Knob’s Creek from Peter’s 1820 census record.
6. We discovered “Vess” records in Virginia connected to an unknown Vest/Vess family!
8. We confirmed (via DNA) that the VESS family is not related to the BASS, BEST, WEST, or VEST families; eliminating them as possible family connections.

Brief Recap On Vess Genealogy

We now know that Peter, Willis, and Nathan Vess are related; however, we have not yet determined how they are related to each other.

Peter and Willis were born in North Carolina and Nathan was born in South Carolina. Peter first appears on record in Rutherford County, North Carolina in 1820 on Knobs Creek with the Toney, Pettit, and Mooney families (all members of Bill’s Creek Baptist Church).

Nathan’s first appearance on record is also in Rutherford County, North Carolina, but in 1830 with his in-laws, the Bellew family. The Bellew and Gosnell families are related and are prominent families in Glassy Mountain, Greenville County, South Carolina (aka Dark Corners). Also, Peter’s grandson, David Andrew Vess married Magnolia “Maggie” Gosnell, who is related to Nathan’s wife, Clarinda Bellew.

Willis first appears on record in Franklin County, Alabama in 1830. According to Anna Popejoy, long time researcher of the Vess and Whitlock families, states that the father of Willis Vess (John Vess) had been living in Foxtrap since 1819. Y-DNA analysis, via familytreedna.com, confirms Willis Vess and Peter Vess (Andrew Logan Vess) are definitely part of the same VESS family.

Familytreedna.com (FTDNA) also shows that the VESS and TRAVERS family are closely related; however, we do not know how they are related. There are several reasons as to why FTDNA may group two different surnames closely together; either we are extremely close cousins, one family that split apart during a time before surnames, or a male Travers ancestor took on the Vess name (or vice versa). To unravel this mystery, it would be extremely helpful to have more male Vess descendants participate in Y-DNA Testing.

The Travers family is from Lancashire, England and they have traced their family to Dorchester, Maryland. Whether there is a connection between the Vess and Travers family in Colonial America has yet to be discovered (the families may have split long before they arrived in America).

With the help of Y-DNA and documented family histories, we’ve been able to eliminate the BASS, BEST, WEST, and VEST families as potential ancestors for the Vess family.

The BASS family has a rich Native American background. The BEST family (original surname BOSCH) can trace their family back to their arrival in the 1740’s with the Ecker family (in-laws) from Germany. The WEST family has been ruled out by their extensive West Family DNA Project. And the VEST family, descendants of John Daniel Vest belong to an entirely different Haplogroup than our VESS family. To my knowledge, there is no available DNA information on the VASS/VOSS/ VAULX families.

We have recently discovered a VEST/VESS family in Patrick County, Virginia who may be related to the VEST/VESS family in Rockbridge, Virginia. We have yet to find any records suggesting that they may belong to the VEST family (John Daniel Vest), which is extremely encouraging for our VESS family, and therefore a new chapter begins!

I am in the process of investigating the Life of Willis Vess and hopefully, with any luck, we can uncover some of Anna Popejoy’s research to help us! I plan to explore more families in and surrounding Patrick County, Virginia – including Surry and Stokes County, North Carolina. All in addition to finding out more about the VOSS/VASS/ VAULX families who seem to live very close to the TRAVERS family in both Dorchester, Maryland and the abolished Albemarle County in North Carolina.

Familytreedna.com
not an affiliated link










Untangling Virginia’s VEST Families

/ J. V. / 1 Comment

We so badly want to connect our VESS family to William Tunwell VEST of Stokes County, North Carolina; mostly, because it seems to be the only thing that makes the most sense!

While researching Willis Vess in Alabama, I took a slight detour back to the VEST family of Virginia, because I discovered a VEST family 2 counties east of Willis Vess taunting me with records as early as 1818. I had to figure out who they were.

Long story short, I searched for every early VEST record I could find in Virginia and started plotting them on a map. Then, with the help of Y-DNA information provided by a fellow researcher, I started the process of elimination. The final results surprisingly revealed another VEST / VESS family!

Why Does William Tunwell Vest Seem Like A Connection?

Despite having BEST, VOSS, and VASS families also in North Carolina to consider, I was hoping there was a connection with William Tunwell VEST; mostly, because he makes the most sense for the time, place, and names.

Peter Vess
Peter Vess of Rutherford County, NC was born between 1791-1794 in North Carolina and most of his records are found under the “VEST” surname; except for the 1830 census (Voss) and his 1831 land record (Vess).

After his death sometime before 1844, the “VEST” surname continued with his wife Catherine and their sons, as shown in Bill’s Creek Baptist Church: Two Hundred Year History, by Helen M. Lu. It wasn’t until 1849, when the “Vess” surname really stuck, in both census and church records. Therefore, it is easy to assume that Peter maybe connected to the VEST family.

We were even 100% confident that we had discovered his connection with the VEST family when we found a Surry County War of 1812-1814 record listing a “Peter VEST.” Not only is Surry County right next to Stokes County in North Carolina, but also the names of the other soldiers listed with Peter VEST seem to have connections with the grandchildren of William Tunwell VEST through his son Isham VEST. Because there doesn’t appear to be any VEST families in Surry County, the VEST family next door (in Stokes County) seems like a good fit.

A possible connection to William Tunwell VEST became even more enticing when records for Peter Vess suggested his father may have been named John Vess (1831 Rutherford Co. land grant record). According to the Last Will and Testament of William Tunwell VEST (1812), he just so happens to have a son named John VEST!

Willis Vess
William Tunwell Vest also seems like a potential ancestor to Willis Vess.

Willis Vess was born in North Carolina (abt) 1810, supposedly to “John Vess and Maragaret Vaughn” who are said to have also been born in North Carolina. Because William Tunwell VEST had a son named John VEST, it appeared there could be a connection; however, John VEST married Eliza RAY (not Margaret Vaughn). Of course, John could have been married twice, but records show us that John VEST (despite who he was married to) appears to have been living in North Carolina (or Indiana-whichever source you pick) during the time that the father of Willis Vess was living in Alabama; therefore they must not be the same person.

Nathan Vess
Interestingly, there haven’t been any plausible ideas between William Tunwell Vest and Nathan Vess. Because Nathan was born in South Carolina, one could possibly conclude he is Peter’s cousin rather than his brother. So, Nathan’s lack of connection to the VEST family in Stokes County, NC never really seemed like such a big deal.

The VEST & VESS Families Are Not Related

According to information from FamilytreeDNA.com, the VEST and VESS families are not related! In fact, they don’t even share the same Haplogroup!

The descendants of John Daniel VEST (VEST family of Virginia) belong to Haplogroup-I, whereas the descendants of Willis Vess and Andrew Logan Vess (our VESS family) belong to Haplogroup- R (R1a). That’s quite a distance from each other on the Y-Haplogroup tree.


So, we can pretty much eliminate any VEST family related to John Daniel Vest as being possible ancestors, including William Tunwell VEST of Stokes County, North Carolina.

I was holding onto William Tunwell VEST for a long time, just in case; however, I eventually discovered that he is the son of John Daniel VEST.

In the Last Will and Testament of John Daniel Vest (1765) of Chesterfield County, Virginia, John names his wife “Ann Vest” (likely Charolette Ann Bakes) as well as his 7 children: “John Vest, Valentine Vest, Elizabeth Vest, James Vest, George Vest, Phillip Vest, and William Tunwell Vest.”
[Transcribed by Sandra Lake Lassen March 1993 – Ancestry.com]

By the way, I discovered the VEST family near Willis Vess in Alabama are descendants of John Daniel Vest through George Washington Vest– so, no relation to Willis Vess.

Mapping VEST Families

Instead of trying to untangle the many different branches of the VEST family, I decided it would be better to us their records to plot them all on a map. During this process, I came to discover that a lot of VEST families do seem to be descendants of John Daniel Vest and Charolette Ann Bakes. The family appears to have originated from Chesterfield and Powhatan County, VA and then migrated westward into Bedford County, then down into Franklin and Floyd Counties, before conquering the rest of the United States.

After finishing my map, two VESS/VEST families who do not seem to have any connection with the John Daniel Vest family stood out!

The Map
The counties [below] highlighted in red contain VEST records.
The counties marked with an X have records that strongly suggest a relationship with John Daniel Vest. And, the counties left, with no X, have records with both the VESS and VEST surname.

This map is not 100% accurate. It is very likely that there are areas and families I missed; especially, since documentation of these VESS-VEST families is scarce and require deep digging into Virginia archives. The purpose of this map is to see if we could identify any “separate” families, such as those using the VESS surname.

Exploring VESS/VEST Families

Rockbridge County and Patrick County, Virginia are the only two counties where I have found records with the VESS name and families whose records seem to use the VESS and VEST surname interchangeably, and interestingly, neither of them seem to have any records that suggest (at this time) they are connected to the John Daniel Vest family! So, who are they and do they have any connection to our VESS family?

VESS/VEST family of Rockbridge, Virginia

According to my ancestral DNA, I have distant DNA-relatives who are descendants of Addison Vess of Rockbridge County, Virginia through my VESS line. My project, of course, could be flawed as the connection could be distant, possibly connected between different families related to Addison Vess.

However, I used the same search method again for the VEST name and more DNA-relatives came up; all related to Vess families in Rockbridge, VA.   I did not get any DNA-relatives descending from the John Daniel Vest family.

The Vest/Vess family living in Rockbridge are found near Colliers Creek and Kerrs Creek.  Library of Congress  Looking at this map [below], there are family surnames that I recognize from bits and pieces of my research on the Vess family: Hostetter, Ailstock, Noel, Morris, and Tolly, and Armstrong.



William, Peter, & Samuel VESS/VEST of Patrick County

As mentioned in a previous post, “What We Know So Far,” we recently discovered a Vess/Vest family in Patrick County, Virginia who we have no idea (like the Rockbridge family) as to whether they are related to the VESS or VEST family (perhaps neither).

I was provided a list of land deeds for Patrick County, Virginia (1791-1801) to compare to the residents in Tryon County, North Carolina (1769-1779) to see if there was any kind of connection. Unfortunately, I did not find anything significant, for that Tryon County records are much older than the Patrick County records and it just wouldn’t make sense that families would travel so far south just to end back up North. I guess they could have, but probably unlikely during a time when families were migrating out west and down south.

The records we find in Patrick County, Virginia include a William, Peter, and a Samuel Vess (VEST/VOSS) who lived on the border of Patrick County and Henry County (as shown on the map below) in Bull Mountain, North Mayo River, and Koger Creek, just below Franklin County, Virginia. 

These records also show family surnames that I recognize from bits and pieces of my research on the Vess family: Duncan, Dodson, Willis, Watson, Reynolds, Sharp, Hooker, and Randal.



HAIRSTON & PENN Families: A Little Local History
While researching some of the families on this deed list, I discovered that the HAIRSTON and PENN families (both on the deed list) have a bit of history in the area.

George HAIRSTON built Beaver Creek Plantation which was a tobacco plantation and a very large slave-trading post in Martinsville, VA (east of Koger Creek in Henry Co.).  He served under Col. Abraham PENN who was the original owner of the land that George Hairston built his plantation on (using a royal grant).  The PENN family built “Poplar Grove” plantation in Patrick County, VA near Patrick Springs (west of North Mayo River).  And both HAIRSTON and PENN families married into the STOVALL family- all connected.  

There appears to be several plantations in the area, all of which utilized slaves and indentured servants. Indentured servants generally had a 7 year contract and in return for their service, their masters often granted them land. Looking at records on Patrick County, VA Genweb, we find deed records referred to an “Indenture,” where land was transferred to the “apprentice” after all debts and terms of their contract have been satisfied.

Jonathan William Vess of Texas: Koger Creek
According to the deed list, William Vess/Vest is shown near a Herron/ Heron family and as previously known, marriage records show Elizabeth Herron having married Johnathan William Vess in 1791 in Patrick County, Virginia. Johnathan William Vess and Elizabeth Heron traveled with Stephen F. Austin from Missouri to Texas (Republic of Texas) during the 1820’s. This William Vess/Vest on the Patrick County deed list may either be Jonathan himself or perhaps his father.

Peter Vess and William Vess/Voss: North Mayo River
According to the deed list, west of Koger Creek are residents of the North Mayo River which includes Peter Vess, William Vess/Voss, Samuel Vess, William Willis, and William Sharp.

This Vess/Voss family is most interesting for that we see them with the Willis, Dodson, and Sharp families (family surnames that are also found in Franklin County, Alabama with Willis Vess).

To make things even more interesting, we found a 1785 marriage record for Peter Vess and Pugnance Vaughn in Henry County. (Henry County is next to Patrick County, and there was a time when both counties were one, called Patrick-Henry County)

Also discovered, is a 1793 Patrick County, Virginia deed record (via John DUNCAN) referencing, Peter Vess and his wife Margaret.

What is interesting about this, is that according to Anna Popejoy, the parents of Willis Vess were John Vess and Margaret Vaughn. To this day, we do not know where she got this information; however, we are now wondering, if this is them.

Perhaps their full names were John Peter Vess and Pugnance Margaret Vaughn??? Also note, that the brother of Willis Vess is supposedly “John Peter Vess,” perhaps he was a John Peter Vess Jr.?

In addition, records also show land transactions between Peter Vess and Samuel Vess via John Duncan. At the bottom of this particular deed list (with Peter and Samuel), you will also find a Whitlock family.

Are These VESS/VEST Families Related

It is plausible that the Rockbridge VESS/VEST family and the Patrick County VESS/VEST families are related to each other, for that records of the Patrick County family (earliest record 1785) come before the records of the Rockbridge family (earliest record 1818); suggesting one of the Vess members may have migrated to Rockbridge, Virginia from Patrick County, Virginia.

It has also been observed that Samuel Vess of Patrick County, Virginia disappeared before Peter and William Vess; which makes us wonder if he is (or is related to) Samuel Harvey Vess of Rockbridge, Virginia (1830 records).

We do not know if they are genetically related to the our Vess family; however, genealogical records seem to support some kind of connection.

Full Recap

  • The Vest family of Virginia and our Vess family are not related (two separate Haplogroups).
  • There is no genetic relationship between our Vess family and William Tunwell Vest in Stokes County, North Carolina.
  • Maps reveal a separate VESS/VEST family residing in Rockbridge and Patrick County, Virginia. It is not yet know if these two VESS/VEST families are related, but it is plausible considering the record dates.
  • We have likely discovered the families of Jonathan William Vess and Elizabeth Heron (of Republic of Texas) in Patrick County, Virginia on Koger Creek.
  • We have discovered that there is a Peter, Samuel, and William VESS/VOSS on the North Mayo River with a Willis, Sharp, and possibly a Whitlock family.
  • The area in which we find these families in Patrick County, has a history of plantations and records that suggest some of the land owners were once indentured servants.
  • Many family surnames found in both Rockbridge and Patrick County, Virginia are familiar names seen elsewhere in Vess family research; especially, regarding Peter and Willis Vess.

No definite conclusions can be made at this time; however, these new discoveries seem promising!
It appears that a new chapter in Vess Genealogy has just begun!

If you are or know someone who is a male descendant with the VESS or VEST surname, please consider participating in Y-DNA testing through FamilytreeDNA.com to help us unravel the mysteries of the VESS family!

Again, a HUGE THANK YOU to everyone who has shared their findings with me on the Vess name in effort to piece together VESS family history!
















Investigating Willis Vess of Alabama: A Stumbling Start

/ J. V. / 2 Comments

This past weekend, I began to research Willis Vess of Alabama, just as extensively as Peter Vess of North Carolina; but I immediately stumbled upon a couple of genealogy road-blocks.

First of all, early Alabama records are weird.

Locating The Vess Family

In my opinion, the best way to research early families is to pin-point where they once lived and explore every part of their community, leaving no stone unturned.

Census records tell us that Willis Vess lived in Franklin County, Alabama (1830-1860) and then in Colbert County, Alabama (1870-1880). I suspect a county change rather than a physical move; which was later confirmed by maps.


Willis Vess was a farmer who had several properties and without the assistance of maps, I would have never been able to locate his properties; let alone find them in the correct county.

His land records state “Huntsville.”

Huntsville is in Madison county, a couple of counties east of Franklin and Colbert County.

This was confusing, especially, since the description of land does not reference rivers or creeks, but instead “Huntsville” coordinates; which kind of implies the property is in Huntsville.

Did Willis Vess live in Franklin / Colbert County, but had farm land in Madison County?

Well, turns out that Huntsville was just a place that sold land. It says so, on an official land record available for Willis Vess; as if it was written in Old English by Dr. Suess!

Image below reads: “the North West quarter of the North East quarter of Section two in Township six of Range seven West, in the District of Lands Subject to Sale at Huntsville Alabama, certifying forty acres and four hundredths of an acre.”

Or so, that is what I think it reads. I had to read it several times, before finally comprehending what it really says!

But yeah, the “district of lands subject to sale at Huntsville Alabama,” means Willis Vess purchased his land (located in Franklin County) through the Huntsville land-office in Madison County. And note, the only reference to “Franklin County” on this record, is its greeting to “Willis Vess of Franklin County, Alabama.”

And we wonder why so many records get lost!

Fox Trap Creek


If there are no creeks or rivers to reference, where does one start to look?

Fortunately, I got a hint from FindAGrave.com (of all places).
If you look at the memorial for John Vess, father of Willis Vess, created by Anna Popejoy (long-time researcher), it states:

“Mr John Vess was in Foxtrap by 1818. He built a Log Cabin in 1819/20. Cabin is still standing.”

I scoured the Internet. I didn’t know if Foxtrap was a community, creek, river, town, fort, plantation, mountain- or just some special spot only known to locals.

Surprisingly, I found Foxtrap on Google maps, by searching around Mountain Star (per sources on Ancestry.com). It is a creek that starts in Colbert County and extends downward into Franklin County, crossing Mountain Star Rd; which accurately reflects the county change seen in the census records for Willis Vess.


Interestingly, there are a few creeks named after early families surrounding Mountain Star; most notably: DODSON Branch and WHITLOCK Branch.

And for a good chuckle, there is also Rock Creek, Mud Creek, & Spring Creek (I assume these particular creeks had rocks, mud, and a spring) and then there is also Stinking Bear Creek which I would love to hear the story behind that one!

Then, after I spent an hour doing it the hard way….I found this on Alabama Genweb (Land Patent Mapping)! It has everyone!

This is a great resource to help me research neighbors (like I did with Peter and Nathan VESS), but I wish it had a date on it. I mean, some of these neighbors could have settled in as late as the 1880’s, which is not exactly helpful in tracing early settlers prior to 1820.

Where Did John Vess Come From

Of course this is multi-million dollar question! Where in the world did John Vess come from!

Besides an old cabin, there really isn’t any proof that John Vess ever existed – no census records or even a grave stone.

Franklin County, Alabama was established in February 1818 and according to Anna Popejoy (FindAGrave.com), this is about the time John Vess arrived to Foxtrap and according to Whitlock sources, it wasn’t until the 1820’s that the Whitlock family arrived from Georgia with the Thompson and Pennington families.

Looking at old maps between 1810-1820, it’s all Indian territory (including the western parts of Tennessee directly above Alabama).

One doesn’t just pack up their entire family and head 400+ miles for Indian territory alone; so there is a really good chance the Vess family didn’t travel alone. And, the safest route (I can think of) from North Carolina to Foxtrap Creek in Alabama would have probably been to go through territory already owned by the United States: South Carolina, Georgia, then Alabama.

So instead of traveling through Tennessee, John might have gone down through Rutherford County, North Carolina (Willis family) into Greenville County, South Carolina (Bellew and Gosnell family), through Georgia (Whitlock family), and straight across into Madison County (Huntsville) and finally settling in Foxtrap.

Of course, that is just a theory; one that might change if we find evidence of a connection with the VEST family who seem to have migrated into Tennessee, Kentucky, and Ohio.

The 1820 Census Blunder


If John Vess was living in Foxtrap since 1818, why is he not found on the 1820 census?
Was he so remote he got missed?

I guess I am not the only one who noticed, because apparently there is a very good chance he was missed!

According to an article posted on AL.com, there was a “mortifying miscount of the 1820 census,” where census workers supposedly quit during the census-taking process!

I don’t think any of the families in the Mountain Star area had been counted, because I do not recognize any of the names on the 1820 census for Franklin County, Alabama. There are no Whitlock, Dodson, Orr, Willis, Smith, Vandiver, or Isabell families listed on the census, but maybe they hadn’t arrived yet.

However, I still do not think the VESS family was alone.

Courthouse Fire

Not only do we have an incomplete census (when we really need one), but Franklin County also had a court house fire (in 1890). Who knows what records were lost (perhaps missing census tallies).

A Quick Recap Of What We Know

Despite such a stumbling start, we have learned quite a bit!

With DNA testing, we now know that Willis Vess of Alabama and Andrew Logan Vess of Rutherford County, North Carolina are closely related; but we have yet to figure out where they connect on the family tree.

Willis Vess appeared on record as early as 1837 (land record). He was a farmer who lived around Mountain Star along Foxtrap Creek in Colbert County, Alabama (once Franklin County). He married Talitha Whitlock, whose family arrived sometime during the 1820’s with the Thompson and Pennington families.

Records are scarce due to a census fail in 1820 and a courthouse fire in 1890.

Fortunately, we have a bunch of other resources to explore!

We have a map of neighbors, which means, we can explore records of close neighbors. We might also be able to locate the first settlers who may have traveled to Alabama with John Vess.

We also have the Mississippi Territory census record of 1816 to explore, which covered parts of Alabama before Alabama became a state! It really depends on when and where John Vess arrived in Alabama (via Tennessee or Georgia).

I really look forward to learning more about the VESS family of Alabama!


















Analyzing Ancestral DNA: Vess Genealogy

/ J. V. / 1 Comment

Vess Genealogy has been stuck at a massive roadblock for generations.
In my opinion, I believe there was a name change.

Records do exist. Either we are missing the places they might be (due to county changes) or we are overlooking records, because the surname is indexed wrong due to illegible handwriting.

Our ancestors lived in an area during a time where county lines were constantly changing, which means there are probably some counties that we may never in a zillion years ever think to look for records.

The biggest reason I believe records do exist is because so many other early families of western North Carolina have a paper-trail.

Okay, it is not exactly the neatest of paper-trails for that when you get into early records (early 1800’s and back), surnames are really butchered (horribly misspelled) to the point that even if you squint and look at it sideways, it might (if you shout it from a distance with a little echo) sound phonetically similar to the surname that it was meant to be. So, in most cases, it is the content that usually confirms the persons identity more so than the indexed surname linked to the record.

My point is, if a good portion of early families in the same area have records, there is a good chance the Vess family also has records. Unfortunately, there are too many different surname variants and counties to explore. If we want to move forward a little faster, perhaps genetic genealogy can help us.


Check out this cool video below – A North Carolina dialect that evolved independently due to isolation since the 1600’s. If that is anywhere close to what our ancestors used to talk like, no wonder names were horribly misspelled.

What Is Genetic Genealogy

It is my understanding, as I am 100% new to this, that genetic genealogy is a new approach to tackling difficult ancestors who do not want to be found.

Instead of digging through dusty old archives for records to make family connections, we can now make family connections with the help of DNA relatives. Unfortunately, the name of our stubborn ancestors are not embedded into our DNA, but DNA-relatives can point us in the direction, like a compass, to locate genealogy records that might help us identify a common ancestor.

Essentially, the idea is to use both methods (DNA and records) together to quickly and more accurately make new connections on the family tree.

Y-Chromosome DNA Testing is GOLD

Y-Chromosome DNA testing is gold, but without a lot of participants, it can also be lead.

Every male descendant carries a gene called a Y-Chromosome. Geneticist’s extract the DNA from the Y-Chromosome, analyze it and assign it to a Y-Chromosome Haplogroup (A-R).

A haplogroup consists of a group of people who share very similar DNA with one another suggesting a single common ancestor. An extremely ancient common ancestor.


The more people who participate in Y-DNA testing, the more these Haplogroups can be broken down into smaller groups called a subclade. Subclades are subgroups of Haplogroups. Assignment is largely based on single nucleotide polymorphisms (SNP’s), which are specific mutations that correlate to specific paternal lines. Every time a mutation occurs over thousands of years, that genetic line branches off into a new subclade (or so that is my vague understanding of it).

As more DNA is collected and analyzed, the subclade may change; either resulting in grouping more people together into one subclade (moving from one existing subclade to another existing subclade) or having enough new information to create an entirely new subclade.

The VESS family is assigned to Haplogroup R. Haplogroup R has many different branches (subclades).

When members of the VESS family submitted their DNA, a new subclade was created where they were grouped together with the TRAVERS family (we are closely related), and then, when some members of the VESS family completed the BIG-Y Chromosome test (a more in-depth analysis), the VESS family was later assigned a new subclade although still grouped together with the TRAVERS family. This suggests a mutation.

It is interesting that our group has two different surnames and it kind of makes you wonder who came first: TRAVERS or VESS?

Did a male descendant of the TRAVERS family take the VESS surname, maybe from a step-parent, or was adopted by a VESS family or vice versa. There is also the possibility that our common ancestor could be from a time when surnames didn’t exist. OR we aren’t as closely related as we think and as more people begin to test, the VESS and TRAVERS family might drift apart into two different groups. The only thing I know for sure, is that it is a mystery we cannot solve today.

However, we did identify a new VESS line using Y-Chromosome testing: Willis Vess of Alabama.

The best thing about this DNA database, is that participants often note their oldest known ancestor which gives genealogists a specific location on a map to look for genealogy records. Although we know Andrew Logan Vess and Willis Vess are related, we have yet to determine how they are related to one another on the VESS family tree.

This is what I mean by Y-Chromosome DNA testing being gold but also lead. It has the potential to unravel many VESS mysteries, but without more participants, those mysteries will remain in the dark.

Male descendants carrying the VESS surname or one similar to it (VASS, VOSE, VOSS, VEST, VAUX, etc) are greatly encouraged to participate in Y-DNA testing through Familytreedna.com as there might be a genetic connection.

Autosomal DNA Testing

While Y-Chromosome DNA testing is a more direct route to identifying our paternal ancestors, autosomal DNA testing is more or less like taking the scenic route.

Y-Chromosome DNA tests provide you a much bigger genealogical timeline of just one paternal line that dates back to ancient times, whereas ancestral DNA tests are autosomal, which means they only go back 6-8 generations and is saturated by DNA-relatives on both sides of the family (paternal and maternal lines).

For me, my DNA-relatives related to the VESS line would mainly consist of descendants of Andrew Logan Vess (my third great-grandfather-6th gen). It would just barely (if at all) pick up DNA-relatives descending from Peter, Nathan, and Willis Vess or even their parents. It greatly depends on how many of their descendants have submitted an ancestral DNA test and just how far they descend down the Vess-family line.

With an 8-generation family tree, a DNA test by my mom, and access to DNA information provided by a close family member who is a generation older than me, I have been able to identify DNA-relatives specifically connected to the VESS family line via a lengthy tedious process of elimination.

Fortunately, my mom’s DNA test does half the work for me by identifying DNA-relatives on her side of the family. Then, I look at shared DNA relatives with the family member who is a generation older than me to further identify DNA-relatives that are most likely VESS-related. Because this family member is a generation older than me, their DNA test would detect more DNA-relatives, those who are too distant to be detected by my DNA test.

Any DNA-relative with less than a cM count of 8, do not make it onto the DNA-relatives list (it’s too distant), even though there is a relation on the family tree. In theory, it would probably be best to have our grandparents do an ancestral autosomal DNA test.
cM (centimorgan)= the amount of shared DNA.

My Search Method

I started by making a list of DNA-relatives who carry the VESS name. Next, I made a list of DNA-relatives with the VESS name who also have a public VESS family tree. Lastly, I made a list of DNA-relatives who do not carry the VESS name, but have a public family tree showing they descend (at one point) from a VESS family member.

For each DNA-relative listed, I noted their oldest known ancestor (some I had to research a bit) and I also had to check their shared-relatives list to make sure they didn’t share DNA with my mom (which was the most time consuming part).

My Discoveries

At a glance, autosomal ancestral DNA tests tell us nothing; except, we have a lot of cousins. But after an extensive process of elimination, then entering the information into a spreadsheet, and finally organizing the information from closest DNA-relatives to most distant DNA-relatives does it actually start to get interesting.

1) As expected, majority of our shared DNA-relatives are descendants of Andrew Logan Vess.

2) As you scroll down towards more distant DNA-relatives, we start to see connections with Willis Vess. Based on this, we can probably confidently say that Willis and Peter Vess are very closely related.

3) Willis Vess seems closer to us than Nathan Vess; which may suggest Nathan’s line has either ended or not many of his descendants have done an ancestral DNA test.

4) Also as expected, the autosomal DNA tests just barely detect DNA-relatives who are descendants of Josiah, Alfred, and Alexander Vess (brothers of Andrew Logan Vess).

5) Interestingly, there are a few DNA-relatives whose oldest VESS ancestor is one I do not recognize:

–Susan Ann Elizabeth VESS (b. 1856 Rutherford Co. NC) and Columbus MCGINNIS
*connected to Ledbetter tree and father is noted as Thomas William VEST of Tennessee

–Elizabeth Louise VESS (b. abt 1845 North Carolina) and William LANNING (marriage Henderson, NC)

–Everline VESS and James STEWART (marriage Colbert, Alabama)

–James Marvin VESS (b. 1853 South Carolina) and Sallie Octavia SPRUELL

**One of the Elizabeth’s might be the daughter of Peter Vess

6) But even more interesting are DNA-relatives whose oldest VESS ancestor is Addison Vess/Vest.

You would think this is a solid connection to the VEST family of Virginia, but if you look at the family trees for Addison VESS/VEST, they are not well documented and there is no consistency with Addison’s children or parents, which is a RED FLAG in genealogy.

Final Conclusions

I am not an expert, so please keep in mind my search method could be flawed and thus the information within this post could be highly inaccurate.

We still do not have enough information to find new ancestors, but we do have enough genetic evidence to start digging deeper into the life of Willis Vess without wondering whether or not we are wasting our time. Yes, Y-Chromosome testing confirmed he is related to Peter Vess, but autosomal DNA testing suggests the relation is much closer than we think.

Also, we might want to start to investigate Addison VESS/VEST for that his name appeared quite consistently in the chart below. The reason he showed up, is because his descendants some how took on the VESS name rather than keeping the VEST name like other VEST families; in which I think is intriguing. Why did this particular VEST line evolve into a VESS line?

Well, I guess we better start digging!! 🙂

Similar Surname, Similar Family Story: Vess Genealogy

/ J. V. / 2 Comments

Research Journal – March 2, 2021

Exploring Families With Similar Surnames

Prior to 1820, the “Vess” name seems scarce.
This is either because the Vess family just recently arrived to America or that there was a name change. Today’s research strongly suggests a name change.

When a surname is misspelled, we often tend to overlook important records. My genealogy game plan to bring these records to light is to research the neighbors of Peter, Nathan, and Willis Vess and investigate any nearby families with a similar surname. So far, I have a couple of excellent contenders with the VEST, VOSS, BEST, and BASS families. Unfortunately, I have yet to find any documents to confirm a direct connection with any of them.

With a handful of different families with similar surnames already piled high on my research plate, I had no intention on investigating anymore families; however, I would be foolish to disregard a family whose family story seems quite similar to our own family story…

The VASS Family: Sounds Oddly Familiar

I have spent years reaching out to different families with similar surnames in hopes one would have a similar family story to ours, but nothing ever came close until now…

I stumbled upon the VASS family with a document that wasn’t even about the VASS family itself, but more so about a man named Pendleton in Virginia whose daughter married a Vass. I can’t even tell you why I was looking at Pendleton to begin with, which happens a lot.

In genealogy, one document often leads to another document, then to another and another to the point you’re not exactly sure who it is that you were looking for in the first place! Honestly, I am pretty sure this all started with looking at map.

As I was saying, I stumbled upon a document that led me to more documents about the VASS family in Virginia. After reviewing my notes, I was shocked by how similar their family story is to ours…

1) Instead of Ireland, their “long time” family story has always been about “3 brothers from Germany.”
2) Their name used to be pronounced as “Voss” (just like us).
3) Some say they are German in origin and others say Scotland. (just like us, but instead of Scotland, it is Ireland).

There are a couple of documents pertaining to the VASS family, some of which strongly suggest they are Scottish, as part of the ROSS-Clan, with surname variants of Vaux, Vaus, and Wass. The Wass version is what they believe mistakes them for German. One source states the original name was DE-VALLIBUS; in my opinion, sounds French.

The VASS family was supposedly a prominent family in Virginia via John Vass and Rachel Pendleton. Their descendants eventually went down into North Carolina with the variant surname VOSS. They settled in parts of Casewell and Pasquotank Counties. [Note: There is Greenbury Voss/Vess in Casewell County]

Furthermore, there is a Vincent Vass (b. 1790) who married Mary Cosner living in Stokes County, North Carolina during the early 1800’s. This is interesting, because it means that William Tunwell VEST was not the only family in the area at the time with a similar surname to “VESS.” Also, we have a Peter Vest on a War of 1812 Surry County, NC record that we have not been able to connect to either the VESS or VEST family.

The VASS family is supposedly connected to the North Carolina VOSS family, which got me thinking: Is Frederick “Bass” of Anson County, NC, neighbors with the Bellew family, related to this VASS/VOSS mix?

The document linking the VASS/VOSS family (John Vass & Rachel Pendleton) to Vincent Vass cuts off and does not mention how they are related; unfortunately, I have not been able to find the original publication to read onto the next page.

I have just barely scratched the surface of the VASS family. As I mentioned before, this search initially began with looking at maps, in which I think has something to do with the names Whitlock, Vaughn, & Thompson scribbled on a piece of paper next to the name Pendleton. Of course, I didn’t jot down their connection!

Glasgow, Scotland

All this mention of Scotland, reminded me of Glasgow, Scotland.
See, my DNA results show ancestors having once living in Glasgow, Scotland. This intrigues me, because in the 1820-1830’s, we see records for a “Vess” family arriving to America from Glasgow. I do not know if there is a connection yet, but it is interesting nonetheless.


The VOSE Family: Lancashire, England

As if the pile of families with similar surnames wasn’t big enough, the VASS family led me to another:

There is one source that made a brief connection between the VASS and VOSE family, in which is not well understood. In my opinion, it seems as if they were connected together, because both families share the surname variant of VAUX. However, before tossing this family aside into the “maybe” pile, one particular thing caught my eye: The VOSE family is from Lancashire, England.


This brings me to the TRAVERS family of Lancashire, England. It is my understanding that Y-DNA data currently suggests that the VESS and TRAVERS families are related and it is believed that the two families split “prior to mid-1650.”

Interestingly, I came across a 1784 marriage record for a Mary TRAVERS and an Edward VOCE (VOSE) in Lancashire, England, but no family tree to determine further connections (if any).

The VOSE family is originally from Normandy. Interestingly, (in my opinion) the name DE-VALLIBUS that is supposedly associated with the VASS family, seems more fitting for this VOSE family.

In the early 1600’s, Robert and Sarah Vose migrated to America. Further research shows that the VOSE family prominently living in Massachusetts with no mention of any family migrating South. So with that, I tucked the VOSE family away with the WEST family- ruling them out completely.

Henry Vose of Virginia

Interestingly, buried within a plethora of documentation about the VOSE family in Massachusetts, there is this tiny bit that reads:
“Henry Vose, who arrived in Virginia in 1653.” houseofnames.com

Now, THAT is much closer to the Carolina’s!
I decided to type his info into Ancestry.com where I came across this piece of genealogy gold [right]!

He arrived in North Hampton, Virginia in 1653, sponsored by Anti. Hoskins. And guess what other name is listed with his: William Willis!

This is interesting, because we think the Willis Vess family in Alabama (from North Carolina) might have a connection with a Willis family.

Of course, this doesn’t confirm anything.

No Solid Connections Yet

Although I am disappointed that no new connections have been made, this new information is encouraging.

This new information isn’t pointing me into a new direction (which is exciting), but more so back to where I’ve already been; meaning, there is a good chance I was on the right track, but missed something! I just have to figure out what.

So far, I have recognized that research seems to be on opposite ends of our family history timeline and we are just needing to fill in a 140+/- year gap. We can trace our lineage to Peter, Nathan, and Willis and we know (via DNA) that at some point they were connected to the Travers family in England. So, roughly between 1650 – 1791 is missing.


Well, this should be fun!

Exploring Knob Creek: Interesting Finds

/ J. V. / 3 Comments

January 31, 2021 – Research Journal

The earliest record I have on Peter Vess (Vest) is his 1820 census record for Rutherford County, North Carolina.

I have determined that he was living on “Knob Creek” in 1820; however, according to a map of the Broad River Basin, there are two Knob Creeks. One closest to Bill’s Creek (Bill’s Creek Baptist Church) off the Main Broad River and one closet to Lincoln County off the First Broad River.

I have researched all the families listed on the same census page as Peter and I have yet to confirm which Knob’s Creek Peter was likely living on in 1820. However, I have compared all the names, top to bottom, on the same census page [pg. 377] to the Member list dated 1829-1836 [pg. 115] in Helen M. Lu’s book, Bill’s Creek Baptist Church: Two Hundred Year History, and discovered something remarkable: 1820 Rutherford County Census.


Esom Logan
Peter Vest
David Mooney
Henry Petit (not sure if this is Sr. or Jr.). If it reads “Esq.,” it would be Jr., because he was a Judge.
James Young
Abraham Toney
Francis Young

These men [above] are the only men on that census page (interestingly grouped around Peter) that are connected to Bill’s Creek Baptist church between 1828-1836. Are they neighbors or family?

David Mooney’s children become members in the 1830’s.
Peter Vest and Abraham Toney were members between 1829-1836.
Henry Pettit Sr. became a member in the 1830’s and Jr. was dismissed in the 1830’s (does not say when he became a member).
James Young has records as early as 1828, but does not say when he became a member as records prior to 1827 have been lost. James and Francis Young are related.
Esom Logan has family who become members of Bill’s Creek Baptist Church in the 1850’s, but he is listed as a person of interest due to his connection with James Logan, in which I will explain in a bit…

Knob Creek – Mooney Families

This is where it gets complicated! I only have bits and pieces of the puzzle and so I don’t know how it all fits yet...

David Eaker MOONEY (Mauney) is a descendant of Hans Jacob Mauney/Mani from Switzerland (Palatine Immigrants who arrived on the ship Lydia) and is related to Christian Mauney who used his home as the Tryon County courthouse and jail.

To learn more about the Mooney/Mauney Families click here.


There is a 1798 Rutherford Co. land record for David Mooney, George Mooney, and Henry Site for 150 acres on the branch of “Knobs Creek.” Again, I don’t know which Knobs Creek, but if I were to guess, I would assume it is Knob’s Creek near Christian’s property south of the Catawba River closest to Lincoln County; instead of the Knobs Creek closest to Bill’s Creek Baptist Church.

I also looked at other names on the 1820 census list (a page back and a page forward) to find other land owners to get a better idea on where their properties were in relation to both Knob Creeks on the map, in effort to determine which Knob Creek Peter was likely living on at that time.

Interestingly, the few land-owners that I found on the census record all had land records for properties closer to Lincoln County, along the First and Main Broad Rivers where other Mooney properties can be found: In short, Peter may have been living on the Knobs Creek closest to Lincoln County [green above].

Not only are there connections with Bill’s Creek Baptist Church, but there are family connections too…

David E. Mooney is not shown as a member of Bill’s Creek Baptist Church, but his son Asa Mooney becomes a member in 1834 [pg. 117, Lu] and Asa married Anna Pettit, daughter of Henry Pettit Sr. [above on census].

Henry Pettit Sr. was received by Bill’s Creek Baptist Church in 1833. His daughter Sarah Pettit is married to Abraham Toney [above on census] and their daughter Elizabeth (Betty) Toney is married to David Mooney’s son Felix Mooney. Other sources say Felix is David’s grandson, but either way, they are still related. In fact, the Mooney, Toney, Pettit tree is complicated with numerous relationships! I strongly believe all three of these families lived together on Mooney’s land.

Also, it would not surprise me, if one of Peter’s daughters married into that web of families.
Note: Peter had 3 daughters and there are no records as of yet showing if they ever married; however, for one of his daughters (Elizabeth, I believe) disappears after the 1860 census which may suggest a name change due to marriage.

Mooney, Best, and Gosnell Family Connection

Of course, it gets more interesting…

Without a map of the Broad River Basin, I would have never realized how close the Mooney, Best, and Gosnell families were together! It was when I started to read land surveys that I found them to be close neighbors! Like their properties backed up to one another!

When Tryon County split into Rutherford and Lincoln County in 1779, the Mooney family ended up in the Rutherford County side while the Best and Gosnell families ended up on the Lincoln County side. This is why early census records have them county’s apart; without a map their connection is greatly missed! Further research shows the Mooney family also having land in Mecklenburg Co., but I cannot remember if they are neighbors with the Best family (I have to check the land survey’s again).

Lincoln County 1790 census: Boston BEST & Charles GOSNELL


Another interesting family to come into view is the VINZANT family! The 1790 census shows Gosnell and Best next to each other in Lincoln County. David Mooney is on the 1790 Rutherford County census, next to a Vinzant family who, by the way, Henry Pettit Sr., obtains land from in 1824! I don’t know who the Vinzant/ VanSandt family is yet, but I sure do hope to find out!

The Best Family Are Palatine Immigrants Too


I know the Best family came from Pennsylvania according to a North Carolina census record on Genweb. Further research states that their original surname is “Bosch” and recent research now suggests that I should be able to find their arrival somewhere in the same book as the Mooney [Mani] family! Pennsylvania German Pioneers: A Publication of the Original Lists of Arrivals in the Port of Philadelphia from 1727 to 1808, Vol. I They may have arrived a few years after the Mooney family as I do not see the Bosch family listed on the same passenger list with the Mooney family posted on Olivetreegenealogy.com. [See: Jacob Mani and Peter Ecker]

On the passenger list with Mani and Ecker is also a John Peter Weiss (maybe that is a Vess?). Maybe it wasn’t John, Peter, and Nathan, but John Peter! Dunno! 🙂

South Carolina Pasts

The Gosnell, Mooney, and Best families were close neighbors (on map). There are no records of the Gosnell family being members of Bill’s Creek Baptist Church, which may suggest that the Vess family may have been close friends of the Gosnell family prior to the 1820’s, either through a different church, possibly as neighbors, or they migrated together.

Remember: Nathan Vess married Clarinda Bellew whose mother is supposedly Clarinda GOSNELL. Also, the Tyger River Baptist Church in SC (part of Tryon County) and Bill’s Creek Baptist Church were both members of the Bethel Association.

The Gosnell family is from Baltimore, Maryland. Charles GOSNELL settled in Greenville County, SC, more specifically, Glassy Mountain, SC. You can learn more about the Gosnell family in Baltimore County Families: 1659-1759 by Robert W. Barnes on Ancestry.com (pg. 270). It mentions how Charles GOSNELL moved to Greenville County, SC and also briefly mentions the marriage of Judith BELLEW as the wife of Joshua Gosnell. The Bellew and Gosnell families were popular in Glassy Mountain, SC and you can read about how I found them in the Dark Corners here.

Logan, Webb, Hayes, Willis, Orr, Duncan, Voss, Thompson, Vaughn, & Hodge Families


There is a list of reoccurring family names in which we don’t exactly know their connection to the Vess family (if any):

  • We assume Andrew, Alfred, and Willis may have been named after other families. Andrew Logan Vess, Alfred Webb Vess, and Willis Vess.
  • We can see the Orr, Thompson, and Hodge families near Willis Vess in Alabama, with the Thompson family having traveled to Alabama with the Whitlocks.

    There is an Elizabeth Orr who married a William Voss in Mecklenburg. Interestingly, William Voss is connected to the Voss family in Casewell, NC. There is a Voss family near Willis Vess in Alabama also connected to the Voss family in Casewell, NC.
  • Margaret Vaughn is supposedly the mother of Willis Vess.
  • Duncan family on Patrick County, Virginia tax record connected to a Samuel and Peter Vess.
  • And, the Hayes family being closely related via Y-DNA information.

Well, I have made another remarkable discovery: All these family names can be found in Tryon County, North Carolina!

I do not have enough information at this time to make any solid conclusions, but I do find it extremely interesting that these familiar family names are popping up in the same area since I started using the Broad River Basin map to identify early Tryon County families! These families may be unrelated to the same families mentioned above, but I do think it might be worth checking out.

Back To Esom Logan

Esom Logan on the 1820 census record with Peter Vess is a descendant of James Logan.
The Logan family had numerous tracts of land and some of his descendants in the mid-1800’s were also members of Bill’s Creek Baptist Church. I am not entirely sure if there is a connection, but it is James Logan’s earliest land grant in Tryon County that has caught my attention!

According to his 1779 land record, he obtained 50 acres of land on Vauns Creek [Vaughns Creek], which included the Vauns old cabin.

This record is interesting, because Vaughn’s Creek extends into South Carolina connecting to Lake Lanier, making it one of those properties on the border between North and South Carolina. The families that lived not the border didn’t exactly known whether they were North Carolina residents or South Carolina residents and their records were basically scattered among different counties in both states. Who was the Vaughn family and is there any relation to Margaret Vaughn who is supposedly the mother to Willis Vess?

I do not think Peter was living with Esom Logan in 1820, the Logan family didn’t join Bill’s Creek Baptist Church until the mid-1800’s, whereas Abraham Toney and Peter Vess were members of Bill’s Creek Baptist Church together in the 1820’s.

Quick Recap

  • Peter was likely living on Knob Creek closest to Lincoln County on the Mooney family’s land.
  • Peter, Mooney, Pettit, and Toney families have connections to Bill’s Creek Baptist Church between 1828-1836.
  • Mooney, Pettit, and Toney families are related.
  • Mooney, Best, and Gosnell families are close neighbors.
  • Gosnell family is not part of Bill’s Creek Baptist Church which likely suggests the Vess family knew them prior to 1820 either through a different church, as close neighbors, or traveled together.
  • Pettit, Toney, Bellew, and Gosnell families used to live in South Carolina.
  • Familiar family names such as Logan, Webb, Hayes, Willis, Orr, Duncan, Voss, Thompson, Vaughn, and Hodge are found in the same area as early families of Tryon County.
  • James Logan obtained 50 acres of the Vaughn’s family land which included the Vaughn’s old cabin. Vaughns Creek is located on the border of North and South Carolina.

Where To Next

Like I said, I have a lot of bits and pieces!
However, it may be safe to assume, we have a couple of good leads; unfortunately, these leads venture off into the complicated records of Tryon County, NC.

I am going to start with the resources complied by Brent H. Holcomb for further history and records on Tryon County, NC. I have recently bought one of his books, Tryon County, North Carolina Minutes Of The Court Of Pleas and Quarter Sessions 1769-1779. I hope it will help me map early families of Tryon County!

Well that is pretty much all my Vess research in a nutshell! Please feel free to comment! Any additional information provided regarding Vess Genealogy is always greatly appreciated!


Book Source:
Lu, Helen M. Bill’s Creek Baptist Church: Two Hundred Year History, 1782- 1982. The Author, 1984. 













What We Know So Far – Vess Genealogy

/ J. V. / 3 Comments

Happy New Year!

Let’s start the New Year by reviewing what we know so far about the so-called three brothers from Ireland.

But first, a huge THANK YOU to everyone who has provided me information about their family history, lineage, and research!

The Three Brothers

According to our VESS family story, we descend from three brothers from Ireland: Jonathan, Peter, and Nathan (Nathaniel) Vess. However, records seem to tell a different story…

Records tell us that Jonathan, Peter, and Nathan Vess did in fact exist and that they all existed during the same time period (1790-1880); however, we have not yet found any records confirming their exact relationship to one another. Possibly, because they may have not been brothers at all, but perhaps a mix of relatives: 2 brothers and a father, cousins and 1 uncle, or 2 brothers and a grandfather.

The term brothers was often used to refer to any close male relationship: siblings, father, uncle, cousin, close family friend, or church member.


Interestingly, records tell us that Peter and Nathan were born in America (North and South Carolina). According to Nathan’s records, his parents were born in South Carolina. His family possibly lived in Glassy Mountain, Greenville, South Carolina with the Gosnell and Bellew families (who are related to Nathan’s wife, Clarinda Bellew). We have also discovered a new VESS line closely related to Peter, through a Willis Vess, whose records also state his parents were born in North Carolina.

Links to each of their BIO’s: Peter Vess, Jonathan Vess, and Nathan Vess.

If our VESS family does come from Ireland, research greatly suggests that our family arrived in America sometime prior to the Revolutionary War (1775-1783). And perhaps our family story is true, but we are looking at the wrong generation of men whose names were Jonathan, Peter, and Nathan; as it was once common practice that each generation be named after their forefathers.

VESS family in Patrick County, Virginia

We have recently discovered a “VESS” family in Patrick County, Virginia. As to-date, we have not been able to connect them to the prominent “VEST” family of Virginia; giving us hope that this pocket of Vess family is related to our VESS line.

The earliest records with the name “Vess” can be found in Virginia for a Samuel, Peter, Jonathan, and William Vess:

  • Jonathan Vess married Elizabeth Heron in 1792, Patrick County, VA.
    In 1820, Jonathan Vess and his wife Elizabeth migrated to the Republic of Texas [before Texas was a state]. He is written in the Texas history books, not only because he was one of the first families to travel with Stephen F. Austin (state capital is named after), but also the town of Morales, TX was established on his land and his daughter, Mary Lorena Vess, married Sam McCulloch, Jr., who was a Texas war hero and a man of color.
  • We have found Revolutionary War records under the “Vess” name, for a Samuel, Peter, and William Vess. Peter being distinguished as a Corporal.
  • In addition, Patrick County, VA tax records 1790-1799 lists Samuel and Peter “Vess.”
  • Lastly, there is a War of 1812 record for a “Peter Vest” in Surry County, North Carolina. Thus far, we have not been able to connect him to any of the VESS or VEST families in the area; including the nearby VEST family of Stokes County, NC. However, it should be noted that Patrick County, VA is located directly above Surry County, North Carolina. We also cannot confirm that this Peter “Vest” is the same person as our Peter Vess of Rutherford County, North Carolina.


The Discovery of Willis VESS – DNA Connection

I believe the most significant find of last year, for me at least, was discovering another Vess line closely related to Peter and Nathan: Willis Vess of Franklin County, Alabama.

Familytreedna.com


DNA has confirmed Peter, Nathan, and Willis Vess to be closely related; however, we do not know exactly how they are related to one another.

Y-Chromosome DNA on FamilytreeDNA.com has connected Willis and Peter’s line together and it is AncestryDNA.com, that confirms a “close” relationship between the two lines through shared DNA-relatives.

However, I suspect the relationship to be distant, for that I share more DNA-relatives with Nathan’s line than I do with those on Willis’s line. This may suggest that Nathan is likely more closely related to Peter than Willis; with Nathan and Peter as siblings/half-siblings and Willis a possible cousin. However, this could be inaccurate, largely depending on how many descendants on each line have tested through AncestryDNA.com.

Nonetheless, Willis lived during the same time period as Jonathan, Peter, and Nathan, so we can confidently suggest the connection is either through a parent or grandparent. Which brings me to Willis’s father, John Vess, who was supposedly born in North Carolina (1770) and married Margaret Vaughn.

The Vest Family of Virginia and North Carolina

Virginia
South Carolina

Many researchers suggest John Vess (father of Willis VESS) to be the son of William Tunwell Vest of Stokes County, North Carolina; however, I do not believe this to be true. I have researched the Vest family of Virginia and North Carolina extensively and have not found any records connecting the Vess and Vest families together.

William Tunwell Vess had 5 sons, Samuel, William, Charles, Isham, and John. According to my research (which could be wrong, of course), Samuel and William married “Cannifax” sisters, Charles married a “Doty,” Isham married a “Briggs” and a “Page,” and John married a “Ray.” I have not found any DNA relationships with any of their descendants.

If the Vest and Vess lines are related, they must be related distantly.

However, it may be worth looking into a James Harvey Vest, who is said to be born in Patrick County, VA in 1838. He married Rachel Jane Harper and Mary Calhoun. The reason I mention him, is because FamilytreeDNA has a VESS-VEST DNA Project Group, which states they have found a DNA connection with 2 members related to “VESS.”

We do know for a fact that some VESS lines do descend from the VEST family; however, none of those Vess lines seem to connect with our VESS line.

The VOSS Name

I am often told that our name used to be pronounced, “VOSS.”

Interestingly, there is a VOSS family in North Carolina with Greenbury Voss in Casewell County, North Carolina. He was supposedly born in Maryland and died in Pittsylvania, Virginia, having raised his family in Casewell, North Carolina. I truly have not done much research on the Voss family; however, records for this family include the surnames: VOSS, VASS, VESS, and VAUSE.


Greenbruy Vess may be worth looking further into for several reasons:
1) Records can be found with the Vess name.
2) His sons married into the Cook family that is related to the Cook family who attended Bills Creek Baptist Church (late 1800’s).
3) They are supposedly related to the Vause family in Georgia, who were in Georgia when Peter’s son, Alfred Vess, migrated there.
4) There is a Voss related to Greenbury Voss in Alabama (or Tennessee, if I remember correctly) near Willis’s Vess family!
5) Pittsylvania, Virginia is next to Patrick and Henry County, Virginia.
6) The Gonsell family (connected to Nathan) is from Maryland.

Conclusion

In short, there is no final conclusion as there is still more to explore and discover! The information we discovered and collected last year will certainly help us with our genealogy journey.

Any information you would like to share with us to help us with our research, please feel free to post in the comment sections or join our Facebook Group! I absolutely look forward to sharing new genealogy adventures with you!