blogger

Following The DNA Evidence: Part 1

/ J. V. / 1 Comment

When records are scarce, follow the DNA!

Over the last couple of months, I’ve been following the DNA evidence provided by Vincent Vess and have made some remarkable discoveries that are beginning to shed more light on early Vess family history!!

DNA Triangulation Match 1 (ROSE-SPARKS) 🧬

The DNA evidence begins in Wilkes County, North Carolina via the Rose and Sparks families.

According to DNA research provided by Vincent Vess, descendants of Willis and Peter Vess have DNA matches (via the DNA Triangulation Method) with the Emmanuel John Rose and Reuben Sparks families of Wilkes County, North Carolina. Emmanuel Rose and Reuben Sparks are connected through their children: Elizabeth Rose and John Sparks.

These results suggest that an ancestor of Peter and Willis Vess lie somewhere on the ROSE/SPARKS family tree.

It is believed that the connection to VESS is likely via ROSE, rather than SPARKS. So, I began to research the ROSE families, which surprisingly, led me to the WHITLOCK & GREEN families!

Early Rose Families of Wilkes County, NC

According to the Rose Family Association (DNA Project), there were 2 different earlier ROSE families in Wilkes County, North Carolina during the same time period.

The first family, identified as Y-DNA Group A-1, includes John Rose Sr. and his sons, Benjamin, John Jr., Sterling, and Hosea, all who appear to have lived north of the Yadkin River.

The second family, identified as Y-DNA Group L, is John Rose, who appears to have lived south of the Yadkin River. He is noted as being “closely related, if not, a direct descendant of John Rose and Lucy Bennett (Virginia),” via Bennett Rose and Mary Haustraete (Surry Co. NC). It is also noted that this John Rose eventually settled in White County, Tennessee from Surry/Wilkes County, North Carolina.

Emmanuel Rose: Likely Related to Group L

Emmanuel John Rose 🧬 did not have any sons; therefore, there are no direct descendants available for Y-DNA testing for his lineage. However, family websites for the Emmanuel John Rose family, strongly believe Emmanuel John Rose is also the son of Bennett Rose and Mary Haustraete. If accurate, he would be related to John Rose (Group L).

Furthermore, if accurate, there could be a VESS connection somewhere on the John Rose / Lucy Bennett line.

Looking further into this John Rose, I came across our second DNA Triangulation match: George Washington Parks (Grayson Co. VA), as well as other intriguing connections!

DNA Triangulation Match 2 (Parks) 🧬

John Rose (Group L) obtained land on “Gray’s Creek,” in 1782, in Wilkes County, NC, joining the Gray’s line.

The Gray’s line refers to the property of James Gray (obtained in 1780). James Gray married Elizabeth Parks, daughter of Capt. John Parks Sr. and Mary Jane Sharp. Her brother, James Franklin Parks I, is the grandfather of George Washington Parks🧬 of Grayson County, VA (another DNA Triangulation Match to Vess)!

Brier Creek Baptist Church

Interestingly, Brier Creek Baptist Church is located south of the Yadkin River near the properties of John Rose and James Gray.


Between 1801 – 1805, the Rose, Parks, Sparks, and West (Vest) families are mentioned as members. Brier Creek Baptist Church appears to be the center hub for families north and south of the Yadkin River.

Brier Creek Baptist Church is a branch of the Three Forks Baptist Church. The Three Forks Baptist Church was established by Richard Henry Green. *1787 tax list, Richard Green is listed under the Isabell District with William Vest, Benjamin Duncan, Lawerence Duncan, and Russell Jones (residents of Kings Creek).

Church records reveal that several members, despite being distantly apart, bounced between both churches.

1787 Tax List: Brushy Mountain Community

On the 1787 tax list for Wilkes County, NC, John Rose is listed with some notable families:
Souther, Combs, Smoot, Parks, Fletcher, and Dunkin in the Brushy Mountain community south of the Yadkin River. All these families, at some time or another, have a record connected to the Vest/Vess family.

Note: Absalom Vest and Jonathan Vess appear in the Brushy Mountain Community on record between 1803-1805.

John Rose (Group L) Relocates in 1790

John Rose (Group L) relocates to Surry County, North Carolina in 1790, prior to the arrival of the Vest/Vess family (Peter, Absalom, Jonathan, William, and Pryor 1800-1810).

However, keep in mind, there was an earlier documented “William Vest” in Wilkes County, NC between 1787-1790 on Kings Creek (parts of which is documented as part of Brushy Mt), located south of the Yadkin River, west of John Rose’s property on Gray’s Creek.

In 1790, John Rose is listed on census (Surry Co.) next to the Jarvis family, who are also related to the John Rose/Lucy Bennett family (via Abner Rose). Interestingly, on the same census page, we see Mathew Sparks and William Whitlock…

Sparks, Whitlock, Dodson, Green, & Parks Families

Mathew Sparks is distantly related to Reuben Sparks 🧬 (father of John Sparks, husband of Elizabeth Rose) via family in Maryland. Mathew Sparks died in 1813, having eventually settled on Hunting Creek (border of Wilkes/Surry Co.).

William Whitlock though, is much more interesting…as he is the son of James Whitlock Jr.

James Whitlock Jr. is the son of James Whitlock Sr. and Agnes Christmas. His siblings include Charles, Mary, Thomas, and Nathaniel Whitlock. Nathaniel Whitlock is the grandfather of Talithia Whitlock, wife of Willis Vess in Franklin Co. Alabama.

James, Charles, and Thomas Whitlock settled in Surry/Stokes County, NC from Virginia.

Whitlock-Dodson & Patrick Co. VA Connection
The daughter of Charles Whitlock, Agnes Whitlock, married Reuben Dodson. Reuben Dodson, according to family websites, is believed to be the brother of William Dodson who settled in White County, TN. This would be the same William Dodson who owns property on Caney Fork next to the Pryor, Peter, William, and Willis Vest family.

Furthermore, it is strongly suggested that Reuben and William Dodson are also the sons of Lambeth Dodson from Patrick County, Virginia. Lambeth Dodson is listed next to William and Peter Vess/Vest/Voss on the Patrick County, VA tax list via Mayo River.

Thomas Whitlock, brother of James, Charles, and Nathaniel Whitlock, can be seen on the same page as Peter and Samuel Vess on the 1799 Patrick County, VA Tax List.

Also, note that Abner Hodges is also in Surry County at this time. Abner Hodges is listed on the early tax lists near Samuel Vess in Henry County, VA and then later listed next to Peter Vest on census in White County, TN.

It appears John Rose relocated to an area of families from Patrick County, VA, who are documented in records with the Vess/Vest/Voss family prior to 1800.

Green & Parks Family
There is an 1806 Surry County, NC court record for James Whitlock to oversee a road near Flat Rock, a branch of Hunting Creek. Including in the record is Thomas Whitlock, Richard Green, and James Parks (James Franklin Parks I).

The Whitlock and Green families supposedly have earlier connections, along with the Gray family; however, I do not know the specific connections at this time.

Richard Green created the Three Forks Baptist Church and is listed next to William Vest on the 1787 Wilkes County, NC tax list.

Talithia Whitlock, wife of Willis Vess in Franklin Co. Alabama, is a distant cousin of Richard Green via her mother, Elizabeth Green. They are related via family in Trenton, New Jersey.

Richard Green’s son, Amos Green, is listed on the Bill’s Creek Baptist Church member list (dated 1829-1836) with Peter and Catherine Vest (Vess) in Rutherford County, North Carolina; along with several members of the Souther family from the Brushy Mt. community in Wilkes County, NC.

Where Next…

The Jarvis family in Surry County, NC (related to the Rose family) has land records on Fisher Creek, which is interesting, because Fisher Creek is where we find the Bray family and tax notes mentioning a William “Voss,” who appears to be unrelated to the Vass family in Stokes County.

Also, War of 1812 records for Surry County, NC list a William and Peter “Vest,” who also appear to be unrelated to the VEST family in Stokes County, NC.

At this time, the border between Wilkes and Surry County, along Hunting Creek (Brushy Mt.) might be where some of the Vess family split after 1810, with the Willis Vess line going west to Tennessee (w/ Dodson, Rose, and Hodges) and the Peter Vess line venturing down south to Rutherford County, NC (w/ Green & Souther)…


































Andrew L. Vest: 1789 VS 1849 Marriage Records

/ J. V.


Circulating on numerous genealogy sites is a marriage record dated “1789” for an “Andrew L. Vest and Linnia Holferd.”

This has become extremely controversial, for that many strongly argue that there are 2 generations with ancestors named Andrew Logan Vess, whereas others strongly argue there is only just the one Andrew Logan Vess (1825-1907) who is the son of Peter Vess.

Is there another Andrew Logan Vess? Probably… It’s not entirely unheard of to have multiple generations with the same name; however, are there two generations of “Andrew Logan Vess and Linnia Halford”? Probably not.

This post is about the controversial 1789 record for Andrew L. Vest and Linnia Holferd, my thoughts and opinions with supportive documentation as to why I do not think this record is accurate. The conclusions, however, are up to the individual reader/researcher.

The Record In Question

Pictured below is a marriage record for an “Andrew L. Vest” and a “Linna Holferd” dated 1789 and is being used to suggest that Peter’s parents were Andrew L. Vest (Vess) and Linna Holferd.

About Andrew Logan Vess

Andrew Logan Vess
1825-1907


Andrew Logan Vess and Lucy “Linnia” Malinda Halford have numerous records supporting his existence, which include:
● His picture (above).
● Census Records of him and Linnia (Lucy Malinda Halford).
● Numerous written family records (below)
● Tombstone in Davistown Cemetery (below).
● Marriage Record dated 1849
● Civil War and Pension records
● DNA – The Halford family has extensive well-researched family tree.

It is important to note that Andrew Logan Vess was married twice. His second wife is Cynthia Conner.

Furthermore, we recently discovered that his maternal grandfather was named Andrew, and that many of children of Peter were named after Catherine’s side of the family. Andrew Crook (Abt. 1750-1814) of Rutherford County, North Carolina.

To learn more about the life Andrew Logan Vess, click here.

The family lineage of Andrew Logan Vess written in old-english.
Andrew Logan Vess:
Davistown Cemetery in McDowell County, NC
This is likely a replacement of the original tombstone in which the birthdate was likely the only legible date left from the previous weathered tombstone.

1789 Marriage Record

There is a 1789 marriage record for an “Andrew L. Vest” and a “Linna Holferd,” that is being used to suggest that Peter’s father was Andrew Vest (Vess).

To further suggest the idea of an “older” Andrew Logan Vess, the same record seems to show 2 different Andrew Logan Vess’s, with marriages separated by 78 years.

A Different Record: Marriage Date 1849

But wait, there is a different publication of these marriage records that shows Andrew L. Vest and Linna Holferd married in 1849!
Perhaps this is a typo?

Comparing Two Different Publications

I decided to investigate further by comparing both records, published by two separate entities. As shown below, you can see the only discrepancy between the two different records is the year in which the marriage took place (everything else is the same).

R. O. Ledbetter: Who Is He?

Both publications state R. O. Ledbetter as the bondsman; so perhaps by learning a little bit more about him, we can determine what period of time the marriage between Andrew L. Vest and Linna Holferd actually took place.

The thing is, the Ledbetter family is quite extensive with many family members named Richard. In fact, my 7th great-grandfather is a Richard Ledbetter! So, how can I possibly pin-point the correct Ledbetter?

Interestingly, at the same time that I came across this discrepancy between marriage records, I had just bought the book: Bill’s Creek Baptist Church: Two Hundred Year History, by Helen M. Lu. AND guess who is in it! R. O. Ledbetter!


The earliest account in which R. O. Ledbetter (Richard Overton Ledbetter) is mentioned, is dated 1842, when him and his wife (Elizabeth Harris) was received by the Bill’s Creek Baptist Church. He was an active member from 1842-1854. Within that period of time, he could have certainly been a bondsman for Andrew L. Vest and Linna Holferd whose marriage is dated 1849. He served on several important committees and for several years, was an Assistant Clerk for the church.

His brother Brazilla Ledbetter also attended the church too, in which allowed me to further research R. O. Ledbetter’s birthdate: 1811, in which makes him too young to have been a bondsman for Andrew L. Vest and Linna Holferd in 1789. And, I have not found any older family members named Richard “Overton” Ledbetter, especially, in Rutherford County, North Carolina.

Also, if you review the marriage record for A. L. Vess and Cynthia Conner whose marriage is dated 1867 (Andrew Logan’s second wife), you will find that the bondsman is Wm. Flynn, who also served the church during the same time period as R. O. Ledbetter.

Furthermore, according to the book, Bill’s Creek Baptist Church: Two Hundred Year History, Andrew Logan Vess (son of Peter and Catherine Vess) was received by Bill’s Creek Baptist Church in 1846. The earliest account in which Linnia Halford (his first wife) is mentioned, is dated 1848 (member list). Also note, that Andrew Logan Vess is mentioned in the book under the following names: Andrew L. Vess, Andy Vest, A. L. Vest, Andrew Vest. After thoroughly reading this book, it is clear that there is only one Andrew Logan Vess (Vest).

Conclusion: A Transcription Typo

In my opinion, I strongly believe the marriage date of 1789 in the publication complied by Brent H. Holcomb, to be a transcription typo. It happens.

However, such typos are notorious for making incorrect connections; especially, if one does not know that Andrew Logan Vess (son of Peter and Catherine Vess) was married twice!

I have had many researchers strongly argue that Peter’s father is (in fact) an Andrew Vess; however, it is something they’ve only heard, perhaps by others who were mislead by this widely circulated typo. But, who knows! Maybe Peter’s father is named Andrew; but if so, it may be best to look for other records as evidence to prove it.


Sources:

Lu, H., 1984. Bill’s Creek Baptist Church. Dallas, Tex.: H.M. Lu.



















Vess Family DNA Project Update: TRA-VESS

/ J. V.

Well folks, the plot in Vess genealogy thickens! Dun…Dun…DUN!! Are you ready!!!

The Travers and Vess families appear to be one family!

Awaiting Nail-Biting Seat-Clinching Results

Results from Big-Y tests are remarkably fascinating and invaluable to Family DNA projects, as they have the potential to shake up the ancestral tree with the equivalent force of an 8.0-magnitude earthquake! In short, big changes can occur, rewriting family history!

We’ve been anxiously waiting test results for a Big-Y-tester whose Travers family line connects to the early Travers families in Cork, Ireland.

Although it has been highly suspected that the Travers families of Lancashire, England and the Travers families of Cork, Ireland are related, there has been no genealogical evidence (records) to prove it.

Travers families from both Lancashire, England and Cork, Ireland migrated to America during the late 1600’s; but again, there is no genealogical evidence (or DNA evidence) to prove these two Travers families are of the same lineage. Those from Lancashire, England, settled in Dorchester, Maryland and those from Cork, Ireland settled in areas around Pasquotank, North Carolina.

For the Travers family, a genetic connection between the two geographically distant Travers families (England and Ireland) would be a great new discovery!

For the Vess family, it may provide more answers to our mysterious connection with the Travers family and possibly revealing our true origins!

The TRAVERS/VESS Branch

The Big-Y test assigned the new Travers line (with Ireland connections) to R-CTS11317, which is an English/Scottish branch consisting of the Travers and Vess families.

DNA results strongly suggest (without a doubt) that the TRAVERS and VESS families are one family. Not only is our Vess family genetically related to numerous Travers families from England, but also now a Travers family line from Cork, Ireland!


These DNA results are exciting for everyone! For the Travers family, this opens the door to further explore more early Ireland – England family connections. With more Y-testers, researchers may be able to determine (approximately) when the Ireland lines split from England. For the Vess family, this opens the door to explore Travers genealogy for clues to our “Vess” origins. With more Y-testers, we may be able to identify our direct Travers-Vess line!

DNA results also strongly suggest the Travers and Vess families may have a Norman connection, which is further supported by research published by Albert E. Casey, titled: “Southern Travis, Travers, Traverse families from Lancashire and post-Elizabethan Ireland.” According to Casey, the Travers family is an old Norman family name that settled in Lancashire, England when William the Conquerer invaded England in 1066.

English / Scottish Branch: Travers-Vess branch boxed in yellow



Unfortunately, the newly added Travers line with Ireland connections did not provide any further information about the Travers-Vess lines in America; most likely, because this particular Travers line did not go to America. The ancestral split between the Vess family and this particular Travers line has not been determined yet.

When it comes to looking at the Travers and Vess families in America, DNA data does reveal that the Vess family (descendants of Peter and Willis Vess) split from the Travers of Dorchester, Maryland sometime prior to 1665 in England/Scotland. This means, the Vess families of Rutherford County, North Carolina and Franklin County, Alabama did not directly descend from the Travers families from Maryland in America; but instead, the Vess family most likely broke off from a different unknown Travers line. Whether that ancestral split occurred in America or across the Atlantic, is still yet to be known.

Y-DNA Testing For Vess Families Is Important

Even though it appears the Vess family surname is relatively “young,” in comparison to the Travers surname that appears to date back to William the Conquerer, it is still important for Vess families to do more Y-DNA testing as there is so much we do not know about our family’s early history in America.

At this time, there are only 2 Vess lineages confirmed to have a genetic connection with the Travers family, which is Peter Vess of Rutherford County, North Carolina and Willis Vess of Franklin, County Alabama.

There is no available Y-DNA data for Nathaniel and Jonathan Vess yet; however, such testing would most likely provide fascinating results! It’s been highly suspected that Nathaniel and Jonathan Vess are related, but there is no genealogical evidence (records) to prove it and because they lived over 200+ years ago, Autosomal DNA tests will eventually (sooner rather than later) no longer be able to detect shared DNA relatives.

Y-DNA testing from descendants of the Nathaniel and Jonathan Vess lines will not only help us better understand their connection to each other, but also to other Vess lines in America. At this time, we aren’t even sure if they are related to Peter and Willis Vess or if they too have a genetic connection with the Travers family.

In addition to Nathaniel and Jonathan Vess, we also have other Vess lines to explore, such as the Vess family in Ohio who are descendants of Hiram Vess of Rockbridge County, Virginia. At this time, we do not know the origins of the Vess family in Rockbridge County, Virginia. Are they related to the Travers family too OR are they related to another family with a similar surname: VOSS, VASS, VICE, or VEST.

Although Peter and Willis Vess did not split from the Travers family from Maryland directly, could there be another Vess line that did who we have yet to discover?

Y-DNA testing from descendants with the Travers, Travis, Traverse, Vess, Voss, and Vass names still have so much to tell us!

Vess Origin Story Historically Accurate After All?

Interestingly, Y-DNA data is beginning to prove our Vess family origin story as somewhat historically accurate!

According to the Vess family origin story, the Vess family descends from three brothers from Ireland. One version told, specifically states it was “Cork,” Ireland. Also, as if universally accepted as family fact, the Vess name is not our original surname. Some say it was once pronounced as “Voss” whereas others say it was shortened or completely changed.

This is incredibly fascinating, especially, as there are genealogical records for the Travers family in America under the surname “TRAVESS.” TRA-VESS (or perhaps once pronounced as TRAVOSS) eventually evolved into the surname TRAVIS. We have found that the South Carolina TRAVIS families to be connected to the TRAVERS families in North Carolina who came from Cork, Ireland.

This has lead some Vess family researchers to wonder, if the VESS surname was formed in America rather than across the Atlantic? And, if more Travers families test, will we find an ancestral split between the Travers and Vess families, perhaps along the Cork, Ireland Travers line?

It’s only a matter of time, before the mysteries of our Vess family’s history are finally revealed!

This summary of recent Y-DNA updates is based on information available on familytreedna.com and information kindly provided by Michael Travers, co-admin of the Vess Family DNA Project. Thank you Mike!! 🙂



Jonathan Vess Of Texas-A Possible Vice Connection

/ J. V. / 1 Comment

This is a long post, but I assure you it is worth the read…

Friendly Reminder:
The opinions and thoughts in this post are based on my own personal point of view researching these families. Links to sources are provided to allow the reader / researcher to form their own opinions, thoughts, and conclusions.

Tangled DNA Matches

Genetic genealogy is a great tool in locating stuborn early ancestors; however, the colossal challenge of analyzing autosomal DNA is that it is limited to only 6-8 generations.

For me, my autosomal DNA largely captures descendants of Andrew Logan Vess and Lucy Malinda Halford (my 3rd great grandparents – 6th generation). It also detects a good portion of descendants of Andrew Logan Vess and Cinthia Conner, because we share a good deal of DNA from Andrew Logan Vess.

As we move over on the Vess family tree to the siblings of Andrew Logan Vess (John, Josiah, Alfred, etc.), those matches are more distant as they are barely detectable with <1% DNA match. Interestingly though, comparing the number of shared DNA segments (cM), I match closer to descendants of Willis Vess than I do to the descendants of Nathan Vess, sometimes more closely than the siblings of Andrew Logan Vess! This, in my opinion, likely has A LOT to do with my mother’s deep roots in South Carolina and Georgia.

It is extremely difficult to pry apart my parents shared southern DNA matches.
My mother matches with ALL the descendants of Andrew Logan Vess and Lucy Malinda “Linnia” Halford (the bulk of my shared Vess matches) on my father’s side, because Linnia Halford’s mother, Sarah Jane “Lollie” HILL, is a descendant of William Augustus Hill, my mother’s 7th great-grandfather. To make matters worse, the Halford and Hill families lived next to each other on Knobs Creek in Rutherford County, North Carolina, mingling with so many families connected to the Vess family!

Thomas J. Halford & Sarah Jane “Lollie” Hill
Rutherford County, North Carolina

My mother’s Hill line eventually settled in Anderson, Abbeville County, South Carolina, which just so happens to be a hot spot where many families of interest seem to have converged at one point or another. One HILL ancestor of mine, found his way to Greenville, South Carolina and connected with a BENTLEY from Georgia, opening the flood gates to even more deeper roots in the South.

With this, my mother seems to shares DNA matches with many southern families, including the Nathaniel Vice family (via a Turley connection) that migrated to Alabama as they passed through Georgia.

Interestingly, my mother does not share DNA matches with descendants of REUBEN VICE of South Carolina, who is the son of John Vice and Frances Roebuck. She also does not share DNA matches with VICE families in Kentucky who are likely connected to Nathaniel Vice II (brother of John Vice of South Carolina). This is interesting, because if she doesn’t share those matches, it is likely a connection on my VESS line.

How do I know it’s not a connection on my parents maternal lines?
DNA matches suggest a connection within 6-8 generations back, which would greatly eliminated my parents maternal sides who arrived late to the United States and had very little connection with the south. My father’s maternal side arrived in Ohio in 1894 from Austria and my mother’s maternal side arrived in Michigan in 1948 from England. When looking at shared matches, it is easy to identify and eliminate leads connected to my parents maternal sides.

Exploring Sarah A. Vess & Vardry McBee Connection

Vincent Vess, co-admin of the Vess Family DNA Project, has made an interesting discovery analyzing his own autosomomal DNA.

He discovered a shared DNA match with a Vess descendant of Alabama and a descendant of Sarah A. Vess and Vardry “Nodsed” McBEE; Sarah being the daughter of Jonathan Vess and Elizabeth Heron in Jackson County, Texas.

If the name Vardry McBee sounds oddly familiar, that is because it is a name often seen on many records in North Carolina. According to the Biographical Information section of McBEE Family Papers, Captain Vardry McBee was a constable in 1770 in Tryon County, North Carolina. His son, Vardry McBee Jr., later became a court clerk in Lincoln County, North Carolina in 1812.

The name “Vardry” is used numerous times throughout their family tree. Vardry “Nodsed” McBee, husband of Sarah Ann Vess, being one of them.

Vardry “Nodsed” McBee descends from Captain Vardry McBee (1734) and Hannah ECHOLS from Virginia via Silas Echols McBee Sr. (1765) who is the older brother of Vardry McBee Jr (1775), court clerk of Lincoln County, NC.

Unfortunately, not much is mentioned about Silas Echols McBee Sr. (1765) who appears to have settled in Kentucky. However, according to South Carolina Digital Records, there is a 1785 land record for Silas McBee, next to Vardry McBee (I assume his father-Sr.) on Thickety Creek in the 96th District of South Carolina. [Located North of the Pool and Pettit families] According to Revolutionary War Rosters, Silas and Vardry McBee served under Col. Roebuck (related to Francis Roebuck, wife of John Vice).

We do know that John Vice also had family in Kentucky via Nathaniel Vice II; however, very little is known about them.

Peter White of Texas – Discovery of Henry Vice of Virginia

When Jonathan Vess of Texas died, Elizabeth Heron married Peter White.

Peter White was born in Virginia (1801) to Shadrick White and Sarah Gibson. According to the Annuals of Soutwest Virginia 1769-1800 (pg. 1252), Shadrick was living in an area on or near “Madien Spring Fork Clinch River,” which is located in Tazewell County, VA near the North Fork Holston River.

*Note: Jonathan Vess and Peter White are both listed in Stephen F. Austins Register of Families, both having traveled from Missouri.

I decided to check for VICE families in and around the area and surprisingly, I discovered Henry VICE, living on South Fork Holston River, less than 50 miles away from the White family. Unfortunately, I do not know if Henry Vice is related to John and Nathaniel Vice, however, further research suggests there may be a connection.

1792: Henry Vice joins land with John Vaught and and Jarvis Smyth
1803: Henry Vice adds 60 acres to his own land
1803: Henry Vice joins land with Alexander Campbell and Crockett family
1806: Joseph Williams joins land with Henry Vice

County Boundaries Notes:
Although records for Henry Vice state Wythe County, the South Fork of Holston River is not in Wythe County. It begins in modern day Smyth County and flows through Washington County. Wythe County used to cover parts of Smyth and Washington County prior to 1792. Wythe County also included modern day Tazewell County and extended all the way to Patrick County. Residents in the Holston River area are likely to have records under several different counties.

James Harvey Vest

A few months back I gained an interest in James Harvey Vest (1838) from Patrick County, VA. I noticed the name was on a list of Y-DNA results next to Willis Vess; however, it was explained to me that they are not related to each other, but curiously, neither of them are related to the VEST family of Virginia.

I reached out to W. Langdon, whose family has done extensive research on James Harvey Vest. With their help, I was able to check for shared DNA matches between our families and it turns out that my aunt (via her Vess line) does share a DNA match with a descendant of James Harvey Vest with two interesting families on their family tree: CAUDILL and VESSE (specifically Ephremia Vesse).

We could be connected through our family’s COX line (Pearl Cox), for that the COX and CAUDILL families were close together in Wilkes County, North Carolina. Interestingly, this was during a time when a William Vess was there.

I’ve seen Ephremia Vesse on many trees of shared DNA matches. She is the daughter of John “Vessey” and married Partick Conyngham (Cunningham). The interesting part is that sources say she died in Augusta County, Virginia. A place we have found shared DNA matches among the descendants of Willis and Peter Vess with a descendant of an early Logan family living in Augusta County, near the VESS/VEST family of Rockbridge County, VA. [I will share those findings in a different post, as I have found more pockets of VESS/VEST/ VICE families all along the western counties of Virginia]

CAUDILL and VESSE are also interesting, for that the VICE family supposedly descends from a VESSEY in Frederick County, VA and according to Appalachian Home website, CAUDILL and VICE families are listed as “Allied families.”
What is the connection though?

In 1850, James Harvey Vest (1838) and his sister Nancy Vest were in Tazewell County, Virginia. His sister Nancy, married Joseph White, who I believe is related to the same White family as Peter White and her marriage record states she was born in Patrick County, VA and that her father is “Henry VOSS” and “Mary” (no last name). According to public trees on Ancestry.com, Mary may have a connection to the Caudle family. Could James Harvey Vest be related to Henry Vice?

But, it gets even more interesting…

James Heron: Holston River

I looked at land records for the Holston River area and discovered James Heron. Not only did he have land on the South Fork of the Holston River (like Henry Vice), but also on all the Forks of the Holston River, including the North Fork near the White family.

I can’t help but wonder, is this the same James Heron we see on the Patrick County, VA Deed Records 1791-1801 on Bull Mountain and Koger Creek with William Vess/Voss? Is this James Heron related to Elizabeth Heron, wife of Jonathan Vess of Texas?

The Genealogy Monkey Wrench: Y-DNA

I hate busting bubbles, but James Harvey Vest does not appear to be genetically related to our Vess family. Although we do share the same parent Haplogroup (R), our lineages separated thousands of years ago into R1a and R1b subgroups. Our Vess family branches from R1a, whereas James Harvey Vest branches from R1b. Yet, curiously, genealogical records strongly suggest that both our families may have a connection with the Vice family.

Unfortunately, to the best of my knowledge, there is no available information regarding Y-DNA testing for the VICE family.

But, there is a slight glimmer of hope for a connection, for that our VESS family is mysteriously closely related to the Travers family. So, in theory, it is still plausible that there could be a connection to all these families, perhaps through a half-sibling somewhere.

Quick Recap:

  1. Genealogical records suggest a connection between the VESS and VICE families.
  2. There appears to be a distant connection between an Alabama Vess and a descendant of Jonathan Vess of Texas (via Sarah A. Vess and Vardry McBee).
  3. McBee family has history in North Carolina.
  4. Elizabeth Heron married Peter White after the death of Johnathan Vess. The White family is from Tazewell County, Virginia.
  5. Henry Vice (relation to John Vice family unknown) has land in the Holston River area near the White family.
  6. Research strongly suggests that James Harvey Vest from Partick County, Virginia living in Tazewell County, VA in 1850, may have a connection with the Vice family too.
  7. A marriage record for James Harvey Vest’s sister states their father is “Henry Voss.”
  8. James HERON also has land in the Holston River area. Interestingly, we see the name James HERON with William VESS/VOSS on Bull Mountain and Koger Creek in Patrick County, VA deed records 1791-1801. Is this the same James Heron?
  9. Jonathan Vess and Elizabeth Heron were married in Patrick County, VA.
  10. Further research and autosomal DNA analysis suggests a Vess connection with early VICE families in Virginia and records have revealed more pockets of VESS/VEST/VOSS/VICE families throughout the western counties of Virginia.












































Let’s start in Patrick
He was born in Virginia, 1779 and married Elizabeth Heron in 1791, in Patrick County, Virginia. We have discovered a William Vess/Vest in Patrick County, Virginia living near the Heron family (Patrick County deed records). This is either Jonathan William Vess himself or perhaps his father.

In the mid-1820’s him and his wife, Elizabeth Heron, traveled to Missouri and then down to the Republic of Texas with Stephen F. Austin. In 1831, Jonathan received land from the Mexican government and gave a portion of his land to build the town of Morales, TX (a ghost-town today with a history of outlaws).

John died in 1846. His daughter, Mary Lorena Vess, married Samuel McCulloch Jr., who was a free-slave, famously known for fighting in the Texas Revolution.

Vess/Vest Family Of White County, Tennessee

/ J. V. / 1 Comment

While investigating Willis Vess, I may have found my way back to the Patrick County, VA Vess/Vest family!

My game plan to try to uncover the origins of the Alabama Vess family include looking at maps, neighbors, spouses, genealogy records (census, land, probate, etc), and the history of Alabama.

Investigating Land Records

Franklin County, Alabama was first established in 1818, before Alabama became a state (December 14, 1819). Records of early settlers of northern portions of Alabama may be found in the Mississippi Territory records. Unfortunately, I haven’t found any records of interest.

The earliest record I’ve found on Willis Vess is an 1830 census record for Franklin County, Alabama. However, he is listed as being between the ages of 30-40, living with two females between the ages of 15-30. This does not appear to match the timeline reported on family trees. Also, he is 10 years younger in the 1840 census (listed as being between the ages of 20-30). Census records are notorious for their mistakes.

Interestingly, on the 1830 census record, I do recognize two familiar family names next to Willis Vess: SUGG and THARP.

Willis Vess lived near both of them and the Sugg family has records as early as 1819. In fact, despite the 1820 Alabama census record being supposedly incomplete, it does contain some families from the Foxtrap area [THARP, SUGG, MATLOCK, THOMPSON, and DEBOIS].

Littleberry Matlock is shown on the Alabama Genweb plat map, living next to Willis Vess. Further research reveals that he married Phoebe Tharp whose father is Robert Tharp (1820 census above) and supposedly (not confirmed yet) her mother is a Thompson from Rutherford County, North Carolina. Interesting!

After 1830, we believe Willis Vess married Talitha Whitlock; unfortunately, I have not been able to find a marriage record. However, we do know a lot about the Whitlock family due to extensive research by Anna Popejoy and published works by the Whitlock Newsletter via Google. The Whitlock family arrived in Alabama in 1820 and lived in an area referred to as Saints cross (which is near Foxtrap). I figure this may be how Willis Vess and Talitha Whitlock met each other.

The oldest children of Willis and Talitha Vess married into the Willis family, which may suggest the Vess and Willis families were close (they were close neighbors shown on the map below) and it is believed that the Willis family may have connections with the parents of Willis Vess (no evidence yet).

I do not know when the Willis family arrived in Franklin Alabama, however, both John Willis and Willis Vess appear on the 1830 census record (several pages apart).

Looking at the President’s name on their undated land records for Franklin County, Alabama, it appears that John Willis purchased land near the Foxtrap area before Willis Vess. John Willis’ record [No. 5972] was signed by Andrew Jackson who was President between 1829-1837 and Willis Vess’ record [No. 8737] was signed by Martin Van Buren who was President between 1837-1841.

The map below (looking at surrounding families) seem to have been something that was put together sometime after the 1850’s. The earliest known neighbor near Willis Vess is James Dubois [No. 8705, also issued in 1837] who is seen on the 1820 census record (above). The land record for John Willis signed by Present Andrew Jackson is not dated, but was likely issued between 1829-1837 and land records No. 19711 and 19712 was signed between 1857-1861 when James Buchanan was President. Unfortunately, nothing seems to reveal any clues about the Vess family prior to 1830.

Willis Vess appears to have owned several properties in the Foxtrap area.

I found 3 land records for Willis Vess:
No. 8737 August 5, 1837
No. 20457 & 20252 April 2, 1857 *No. 20451 & 20452 on map (above)
No. 25798 March 1, 1858 (William Vess as heir) *No. 25797 on map (above)


Who is William Vess?
None of the family trees I have come across for Willis Vess have a William Vess on them, so I am not entirely sure who he is; however, it certainly makes my next discovery extremely intriguing…

1846 Tennessee Record: Peter, Willis, William Vess/ Vest

There is one Willis Vess record that intrigues me the most and it is a land record for White County, Tennessee (1846) on Caney Fork.

Is this Willis Vess of Alabama?

Tennessee Virtual Archives

Willis Vess of White County, Tennessee, appears to have 2 land records for a property on Caney Fork:
No. 2012 dated 1831
No. 9156 (addition to No. 2012) dated 1849

The property interestingly joins Daniel Dotson (Dodson).

Looking at census records, I do not see a Willis Vess; however, there is an 1820 and 1830 census record for Peter Vest, whose neighbor is Daniel Dotson (Dodson).

In addition, there is also a William Vess. He also purchases land in 1831 No. 2071, whose property takes over land once owned by John Medley (see 1820 census above). William Dodson and Sam Moore are witnesses listed on the record. William Vess can be found on the 1830 census record. Is this William Vess, the William Vess who is “heir” to the Willis Vess of Alabama’s 1858 land record in Franklin County, Alabama??

And, furthermore, is this Peter Vest, the same Peter Vest listed on the Patrick Co. Deeds (1791-1941 Indexes, grantor pg. 77 on FHL Film 33,333) with wife “Margaret,” who appears to have land next to the Dodson family on North Fork in Patrick County, Virginia? A 1793 transaction which was witnessed by George Dodson Sr., George Dodson Junior, Benjamin Fletcher, and Thomas Dodson.

Perhaps, it is Peter and William Vess of Patrick County, Virginia (Deed Records) on North Fork with William Willis??

Is there an actual connection or is this just coincidence?

Conclusions

Wow!

A Franklin County, Alabama land record for Willis Vess and “heir” William Vess.
A Willis and William Vess in White County, Tennessee, with a Peter Vest.
All near a Dodson family.
And… interestingly, there is a Peter Vess and William Vess in Patrick County, Virginia, not only living next to a Dodson family, but ALSO a Willis family.

I don’t have enough documented evidence to make any solid connections, but I am absolutely intrigued!

Tennessee is a mixing pot of Vest, Voss, Vaulx, and Vess families! Hopefully, with more research, we can determine which family the Vess/Vest family of White County, Tennessee belongs to!














Vess Family DNA Project

/ J. V. / 2 Comments

I am extremely excited to announce that we have been given the opportunity to start a VESS FAMILY DNA PROJECT!

A huge thanks to Marilyn Barton, for allowing us to revive her Vess Family DNA project on Familytreedna.com and also, a huge thanks to Michael Travers and Vincent Vess for managing it for us!

How To Join?

To join and participate, you must have an account with Familytreedna.com.

If you sign up for an account on their homepage, you will be required to buy a DNA kit. However, anyone who has already completed an autosomal test through 23andMe© or AncestryDNA™ or MyHeritage™ can sign up for an account for free by transferring their results to Familytreedna.com.

Click here to get started!
Note: You must download your Raw DNA data first (see directions below).

Downloading Raw Data File To Transfer To Familytreedna.com

Ancestry.com

23&Me.com
Visit you.23andme.com/tools/data/, which should take you directly to the Raw Data Download Page after signing into your account.


MyHeritage.com

Click on this link for step-by-step instructions from yourdnaguide.com.

How Long Does The Transfer Process Take

Familytreedna.com states it takes 3-5 business days to process, but some reviews state it could be as quick as a few hours; it all depends on how many transfers they have to process (it’s a queue system).

However, you can join the Vess Family DNA Project and explore public Haplotrees while you wait for your results to process.

$19 To Access Additional Tools

It is my understanding that a free account opened by transferring DNA results from another vendor, allows you access to FamilyFinder and DNA Projects. However, one must pay $19 to unlock additional tools such as the Chromosome Browser, MyOrigins, and AncientOrigins.

Which isn’t that bad, considering you’re not having to buy an expensive DNA kit again or pay any kind of subscription to continue to access information.

Who Can Participate?

Any member of Familytreedna.com can join the Vess Family DNA Project! It is my understanding that this DNA project is not restricted to any specific type of testers and thus, all DNA tests are able to provide valuable information to the project.

  • Information provided by Autosomal DNA testers (both genders) allow us to make new family connections.
  • Information provided by mtDNA testers allow us to explore maternal roots.
  • Information provided by Y-DNA testers allow us to identify and connect different VESS/ VOSS/VASS/ VEST family lines.
  • Information provided by Big-Y testers allow us to further investigate and unravel the mystery between the Vess and Travers families.

The more participants, the more DNA information we can obtain and analyze, and then the more connections we can make!

Transferring Y-DNA Test Results

If you have already done a Y-DNA test through a different company that used the Sorenson 33 or 46-marker test, you can transfer your results to Familytreedna.com to participate in the Y-DNA portion of the Vess Family DNA Project.

For more information on how to do it, please visit this link: Y-DNA Transfer From Another Company

DNA DAY: Tests On Sale
Now through April 26th

Please visit the Familytreedna.com for accurate pricing and more details.


Disclosure: There are no affiliated links in this post.






Vess Genealogy: A New Chapter

/ J. V.

I am so thrilled to have finally reached a new chapter in Vess Genealogy!

When I started this blog last Fall (August 2020), it was simply just a place to organize digital sources and share my genealogy experiences researching the Vess name. I gave it 2 months!

Remarkably, Vess Genealogy kept on going! I never would have ever imagined I would get to work with so many different people interested in the VESS name nor get an opportunity to meet so many different VESS families! This has been such an amazing genealogy adventure!

A HUGE THANK YOU to everyone helping me unravel the mysteries of the VESS family!

If New To Vess Genealogy, Here’s What You Missed!

For generations, three different VESS lines (maybe more) haven’t been able find their ancestors prior to 1820. A frustrating endeavor leaving many of us to just give up.

However, since last Fall, we achieved the following:

1. We learned more about Peter Vess and his family.
2. We learned a lot about Andrew Logan Vess and his family.
3. We likely uncovered Nathan’s origins in the Dark Corners of South Carolina.
4. We discovered that Peter and Willis Vess are closely related and that our family is closely related to the Travers family!
5. We explored families in Knob’s Creek from Peter’s 1820 census record.
6. We discovered “Vess” records in Virginia connected to an unknown Vest/Vess family!
8. We confirmed (via DNA) that the VESS family is not related to the BASS, BEST, WEST, or VEST families; eliminating them as possible family connections.

Brief Recap On Vess Genealogy

We now know that Peter, Willis, and Nathan Vess are related; however, we have not yet determined how they are related to each other.

Peter and Willis were born in North Carolina and Nathan was born in South Carolina. Peter first appears on record in Rutherford County, North Carolina in 1820 on Knobs Creek with the Toney, Pettit, and Mooney families (all members of Bill’s Creek Baptist Church).

Nathan’s first appearance on record is also in Rutherford County, North Carolina, but in 1830 with his in-laws, the Bellew family. The Bellew and Gosnell families are related and are prominent families in Glassy Mountain, Greenville County, South Carolina (aka Dark Corners). Also, Peter’s grandson, David Andrew Vess married Magnolia “Maggie” Gosnell, who is related to Nathan’s wife, Clarinda Bellew.

Willis first appears on record in Franklin County, Alabama in 1830. According to Anna Popejoy, long time researcher of the Vess and Whitlock families, states that the father of Willis Vess (John Vess) had been living in Foxtrap since 1819. Y-DNA analysis, via familytreedna.com, confirms Willis Vess and Peter Vess (Andrew Logan Vess) are definitely part of the same VESS family.

Familytreedna.com (FTDNA) also shows that the VESS and TRAVERS family are closely related; however, we do not know how they are related. There are several reasons as to why FTDNA may group two different surnames closely together; either we are extremely close cousins, one family that split apart during a time before surnames, or a male Travers ancestor took on the Vess name (or vice versa). To unravel this mystery, it would be extremely helpful to have more male Vess descendants participate in Y-DNA Testing.

The Travers family is from Lancashire, England and they have traced their family to Dorchester, Maryland. Whether there is a connection between the Vess and Travers family in Colonial America has yet to be discovered (the families may have split long before they arrived in America).

With the help of Y-DNA and documented family histories, we’ve been able to eliminate the BASS, BEST, WEST, and VEST families as potential ancestors for the Vess family.

The BASS family has a rich Native American background. The BEST family (original surname BOSCH) can trace their family back to their arrival in the 1740’s with the Ecker family (in-laws) from Germany. The WEST family has been ruled out by their extensive West Family DNA Project. And the VEST family, descendants of John Daniel Vest belong to an entirely different Haplogroup than our VESS family. To my knowledge, there is no available DNA information on the VASS/VOSS/ VAULX families.

We have recently discovered a VEST/VESS family in Patrick County, Virginia who may be related to the VEST/VESS family in Rockbridge, Virginia. We have yet to find any records suggesting that they may belong to the VEST family (John Daniel Vest), which is extremely encouraging for our VESS family, and therefore a new chapter begins!

I am in the process of investigating the Life of Willis Vess and hopefully, with any luck, we can uncover some of Anna Popejoy’s research to help us! I plan to explore more families in and surrounding Patrick County, Virginia – including Surry and Stokes County, North Carolina. All in addition to finding out more about the VOSS/VASS/ VAULX families who seem to live very close to the TRAVERS family in both Dorchester, Maryland and the abolished Albemarle County in North Carolina.

Familytreedna.com
not an affiliated link










Investigating Willis Vess of Alabama: A Stumbling Start

/ J. V. / 2 Comments

This past weekend, I began to research Willis Vess of Alabama, just as extensively as Peter Vess of North Carolina; but I immediately stumbled upon a couple of genealogy road-blocks.

First of all, early Alabama records are weird.

Locating The Vess Family

In my opinion, the best way to research early families is to pin-point where they once lived and explore every part of their community, leaving no stone unturned.

Census records tell us that Willis Vess lived in Franklin County, Alabama (1830-1860) and then in Colbert County, Alabama (1870-1880). I suspect a county change rather than a physical move; which was later confirmed by maps.


Willis Vess was a farmer who had several properties and without the assistance of maps, I would have never been able to locate his properties; let alone find them in the correct county.

His land records state “Huntsville.”

Huntsville is in Madison county, a couple of counties east of Franklin and Colbert County.

This was confusing, especially, since the description of land does not reference rivers or creeks, but instead “Huntsville” coordinates; which kind of implies the property is in Huntsville.

Did Willis Vess live in Franklin / Colbert County, but had farm land in Madison County?

Well, turns out that Huntsville was just a place that sold land. It says so, on an official land record available for Willis Vess; as if it was written in Old English by Dr. Suess!

Image below reads: “the North West quarter of the North East quarter of Section two in Township six of Range seven West, in the District of Lands Subject to Sale at Huntsville Alabama, certifying forty acres and four hundredths of an acre.”

Or so, that is what I think it reads. I had to read it several times, before finally comprehending what it really says!

But yeah, the “district of lands subject to sale at Huntsville Alabama,” means Willis Vess purchased his land (located in Franklin County) through the Huntsville land-office in Madison County. And note, the only reference to “Franklin County” on this record, is its greeting to “Willis Vess of Franklin County, Alabama.”

And we wonder why so many records get lost!

Fox Trap Creek


If there are no creeks or rivers to reference, where does one start to look?

Fortunately, I got a hint from FindAGrave.com (of all places).
If you look at the memorial for John Vess, father of Willis Vess, created by Anna Popejoy (long-time researcher), it states:

“Mr John Vess was in Foxtrap by 1818. He built a Log Cabin in 1819/20. Cabin is still standing.”

I scoured the Internet. I didn’t know if Foxtrap was a community, creek, river, town, fort, plantation, mountain- or just some special spot only known to locals.

Surprisingly, I found Foxtrap on Google maps, by searching around Mountain Star (per sources on Ancestry.com). It is a creek that starts in Colbert County and extends downward into Franklin County, crossing Mountain Star Rd; which accurately reflects the county change seen in the census records for Willis Vess.


Interestingly, there are a few creeks named after early families surrounding Mountain Star; most notably: DODSON Branch and WHITLOCK Branch.

And for a good chuckle, there is also Rock Creek, Mud Creek, & Spring Creek (I assume these particular creeks had rocks, mud, and a spring) and then there is also Stinking Bear Creek which I would love to hear the story behind that one!

Then, after I spent an hour doing it the hard way….I found this on Alabama Genweb (Land Patent Mapping)! It has everyone!

This is a great resource to help me research neighbors (like I did with Peter and Nathan VESS), but I wish it had a date on it. I mean, some of these neighbors could have settled in as late as the 1880’s, which is not exactly helpful in tracing early settlers prior to 1820.

Where Did John Vess Come From

Of course this is multi-million dollar question! Where in the world did John Vess come from!

Besides an old cabin, there really isn’t any proof that John Vess ever existed – no census records or even a grave stone.

Franklin County, Alabama was established in February 1818 and according to Anna Popejoy (FindAGrave.com), this is about the time John Vess arrived to Foxtrap and according to Whitlock sources, it wasn’t until the 1820’s that the Whitlock family arrived from Georgia with the Thompson and Pennington families.

Looking at old maps between 1810-1820, it’s all Indian territory (including the western parts of Tennessee directly above Alabama).

One doesn’t just pack up their entire family and head 400+ miles for Indian territory alone; so there is a really good chance the Vess family didn’t travel alone. And, the safest route (I can think of) from North Carolina to Foxtrap Creek in Alabama would have probably been to go through territory already owned by the United States: South Carolina, Georgia, then Alabama.

So instead of traveling through Tennessee, John might have gone down through Rutherford County, North Carolina (Willis family) into Greenville County, South Carolina (Bellew and Gosnell family), through Georgia (Whitlock family), and straight across into Madison County (Huntsville) and finally settling in Foxtrap.

Of course, that is just a theory; one that might change if we find evidence of a connection with the VEST family who seem to have migrated into Tennessee, Kentucky, and Ohio.

The 1820 Census Blunder


If John Vess was living in Foxtrap since 1818, why is he not found on the 1820 census?
Was he so remote he got missed?

I guess I am not the only one who noticed, because apparently there is a very good chance he was missed!

According to an article posted on AL.com, there was a “mortifying miscount of the 1820 census,” where census workers supposedly quit during the census-taking process!

I don’t think any of the families in the Mountain Star area had been counted, because I do not recognize any of the names on the 1820 census for Franklin County, Alabama. There are no Whitlock, Dodson, Orr, Willis, Smith, Vandiver, or Isabell families listed on the census, but maybe they hadn’t arrived yet.

However, I still do not think the VESS family was alone.

Courthouse Fire

Not only do we have an incomplete census (when we really need one), but Franklin County also had a court house fire (in 1890). Who knows what records were lost (perhaps missing census tallies).

A Quick Recap Of What We Know

Despite such a stumbling start, we have learned quite a bit!

With DNA testing, we now know that Willis Vess of Alabama and Andrew Logan Vess of Rutherford County, North Carolina are closely related; but we have yet to figure out where they connect on the family tree.

Willis Vess appeared on record as early as 1837 (land record). He was a farmer who lived around Mountain Star along Foxtrap Creek in Colbert County, Alabama (once Franklin County). He married Talitha Whitlock, whose family arrived sometime during the 1820’s with the Thompson and Pennington families.

Records are scarce due to a census fail in 1820 and a courthouse fire in 1890.

Fortunately, we have a bunch of other resources to explore!

We have a map of neighbors, which means, we can explore records of close neighbors. We might also be able to locate the first settlers who may have traveled to Alabama with John Vess.

We also have the Mississippi Territory census record of 1816 to explore, which covered parts of Alabama before Alabama became a state! It really depends on when and where John Vess arrived in Alabama (via Tennessee or Georgia).

I really look forward to learning more about the VESS family of Alabama!


















What We Know So Far – Vess Genealogy

/ J. V. / 3 Comments

Happy New Year!

Let’s start the New Year by reviewing what we know so far about the so-called three brothers from Ireland.

But first, a huge THANK YOU to everyone who has provided me information about their family history, lineage, and research!

The Three Brothers

According to our VESS family story, we descend from three brothers from Ireland: Jonathan, Peter, and Nathan (Nathaniel) Vess. However, records seem to tell a different story…

Records tell us that Jonathan, Peter, and Nathan Vess did in fact exist and that they all existed during the same time period (1790-1880); however, we have not yet found any records confirming their exact relationship to one another. Possibly, because they may have not been brothers at all, but perhaps a mix of relatives: 2 brothers and a father, cousins and 1 uncle, or 2 brothers and a grandfather.

The term brothers was often used to refer to any close male relationship: siblings, father, uncle, cousin, close family friend, or church member.


Interestingly, records tell us that Peter and Nathan were born in America (North and South Carolina). According to Nathan’s records, his parents were born in South Carolina. His family possibly lived in Glassy Mountain, Greenville, South Carolina with the Gosnell and Bellew families (who are related to Nathan’s wife, Clarinda Bellew). We have also discovered a new VESS line closely related to Peter, through a Willis Vess, whose records also state his parents were born in North Carolina.

Links to each of their BIO’s: Peter Vess, Jonathan Vess, and Nathan Vess.

If our VESS family does come from Ireland, research greatly suggests that our family arrived in America sometime prior to the Revolutionary War (1775-1783). And perhaps our family story is true, but we are looking at the wrong generation of men whose names were Jonathan, Peter, and Nathan; as it was once common practice that each generation be named after their forefathers.

VESS family in Patrick County, Virginia

We have recently discovered a “VESS” family in Patrick County, Virginia. As to-date, we have not been able to connect them to the prominent “VEST” family of Virginia; giving us hope that this pocket of Vess family is related to our VESS line.

The earliest records with the name “Vess” can be found in Virginia for a Samuel, Peter, Jonathan, and William Vess:

  • Jonathan Vess married Elizabeth Heron in 1792, Patrick County, VA.
    In 1820, Jonathan Vess and his wife Elizabeth migrated to the Republic of Texas [before Texas was a state]. He is written in the Texas history books, not only because he was one of the first families to travel with Stephen F. Austin (state capital is named after), but also the town of Morales, TX was established on his land and his daughter, Mary Lorena Vess, married Sam McCulloch, Jr., who was a Texas war hero and a man of color.
  • We have found Revolutionary War records under the “Vess” name, for a Samuel, Peter, and William Vess. Peter being distinguished as a Corporal.
  • In addition, Patrick County, VA tax records 1790-1799 lists Samuel and Peter “Vess.”
  • Lastly, there is a War of 1812 record for a “Peter Vest” in Surry County, North Carolina. Thus far, we have not been able to connect him to any of the VESS or VEST families in the area; including the nearby VEST family of Stokes County, NC. However, it should be noted that Patrick County, VA is located directly above Surry County, North Carolina. We also cannot confirm that this Peter “Vest” is the same person as our Peter Vess of Rutherford County, North Carolina.


The Discovery of Willis VESS – DNA Connection

I believe the most significant find of last year, for me at least, was discovering another Vess line closely related to Peter and Nathan: Willis Vess of Franklin County, Alabama.

Familytreedna.com


DNA has confirmed Peter, Nathan, and Willis Vess to be closely related; however, we do not know exactly how they are related to one another.

Y-Chromosome DNA on FamilytreeDNA.com has connected Willis and Peter’s line together and it is AncestryDNA.com, that confirms a “close” relationship between the two lines through shared DNA-relatives.

However, I suspect the relationship to be distant, for that I share more DNA-relatives with Nathan’s line than I do with those on Willis’s line. This may suggest that Nathan is likely more closely related to Peter than Willis; with Nathan and Peter as siblings/half-siblings and Willis a possible cousin. However, this could be inaccurate, largely depending on how many descendants on each line have tested through AncestryDNA.com.

Nonetheless, Willis lived during the same time period as Jonathan, Peter, and Nathan, so we can confidently suggest the connection is either through a parent or grandparent. Which brings me to Willis’s father, John Vess, who was supposedly born in North Carolina (1770) and married Margaret Vaughn.

The Vest Family of Virginia and North Carolina

Virginia
South Carolina

Many researchers suggest John Vess (father of Willis VESS) to be the son of William Tunwell Vest of Stokes County, North Carolina; however, I do not believe this to be true. I have researched the Vest family of Virginia and North Carolina extensively and have not found any records connecting the Vess and Vest families together.

William Tunwell Vess had 5 sons, Samuel, William, Charles, Isham, and John. According to my research (which could be wrong, of course), Samuel and William married “Cannifax” sisters, Charles married a “Doty,” Isham married a “Briggs” and a “Page,” and John married a “Ray.” I have not found any DNA relationships with any of their descendants.

If the Vest and Vess lines are related, they must be related distantly.

However, it may be worth looking into a James Harvey Vest, who is said to be born in Patrick County, VA in 1838. He married Rachel Jane Harper and Mary Calhoun. The reason I mention him, is because FamilytreeDNA has a VESS-VEST DNA Project Group, which states they have found a DNA connection with 2 members related to “VESS.”

We do know for a fact that some VESS lines do descend from the VEST family; however, none of those Vess lines seem to connect with our VESS line.

The VOSS Name

I am often told that our name used to be pronounced, “VOSS.”

Interestingly, there is a VOSS family in North Carolina with Greenbury Voss in Casewell County, North Carolina. He was supposedly born in Maryland and died in Pittsylvania, Virginia, having raised his family in Casewell, North Carolina. I truly have not done much research on the Voss family; however, records for this family include the surnames: VOSS, VASS, VESS, and VAUSE.


Greenbruy Vess may be worth looking further into for several reasons:
1) Records can be found with the Vess name.
2) His sons married into the Cook family that is related to the Cook family who attended Bills Creek Baptist Church (late 1800’s).
3) They are supposedly related to the Vause family in Georgia, who were in Georgia when Peter’s son, Alfred Vess, migrated there.
4) There is a Voss related to Greenbury Voss in Alabama (or Tennessee, if I remember correctly) near Willis’s Vess family!
5) Pittsylvania, Virginia is next to Patrick and Henry County, Virginia.
6) The Gonsell family (connected to Nathan) is from Maryland.

Conclusion

In short, there is no final conclusion as there is still more to explore and discover! The information we discovered and collected last year will certainly help us with our genealogy journey.

Any information you would like to share with us to help us with our research, please feel free to post in the comment sections or join our Facebook Group! I absolutely look forward to sharing new genealogy adventures with you!

















Intriguing New Discoveries: Willis Vess

/ J. V. / 1 Comment

I was recently asked if I knew anything about a Willis VESS and his connection to a John VESS.

Well, the short answer is: Very little.

But, I did stumbled upon new intriguing information that is probably worth brain storming…

I have a lot of research and I wouldn’t be surprised if the answers we seek about the VESS family are in plain sight somewhere in my messy genealogy files!

I say this, because I truly do not know how to start this post…
Vess Genealogy is like trying to put together a zillion-piece puzzle with all the puzzle pieces face down! And there is always that one piece we keep going back to, because we know what general area it belongs to; but it doesn’t quite have a space for it to fit into yet.

Simply, I don’t know what I got until I come across it again.

With that said, I will start with Willis Vess.

Willis Vess of Alabama

Willis VESS (born abt. 1810) married Talitha WHITLOCK.
Many researchers who I’ve spoken to have found connections to Willis VESS through the WHITLOCK family (including myself). I am related to Talitha WHITLOCK through my mother’s BENTLY side in Georgia.

Interestingly though, everyone seems to agree unanimously that Willis VESS is the son of a John VESS.

You can find a picture of his cabin on FindAGrave.com, posted by Anna Popejoy, who I’ve been told was a genealogist who has done Y-Chromosome testing.

We do not know who was tested specifically, as it had to be a male descendant, but supposedly there is a DNA connection between the Willis VESS line and the Peter VESS line. Where this connection is on the family tree is still a mystery.

According to online sources, John VESS was born abt. 1770 in North Carolina. He supposedly married Margaret VAUGHN and they had two sons: Willis VESS born abt. 1810 and John Peter VESS born abt. 1822.

According to my research, the VESS/VEST family from Virginia appears on record in North Carolina as early as 1790; obtaining land as early as 1798 (Stokes Co.). If they were in the area any earlier, it would have been Rowan County.

Many researchers (including myself) try to connect Willis VESS of Alabama to William Tunwell VEST (1735 VA-1812 NC) of Stokes County, North Carolina. But, research simply does not support any kind of connection between the two families (at least not directly).

William Tunwell VEST did have a son named John VEST. However, John VEST was born in Virginia (abt. 1765). He married Eliza RAY and you can follow him on several census records with his brothers (Charles, William, and Samuel VEST) in Stokes County, North Carolina. He died in 1833. So, he is likely not the father of Willis VESS.

Intriguing New Discoveries

Current research suggests that William Tunwell VEST may have not been the only VESS/VEST family in North Carolina!

I have been working on compiling VESS, VEST, VOSS, and VASS marriages from 1790-1820. Majority of the VEST marriages are in Stokes County, North Carolina with connections with William Tunwell VEST (his children and his grandchildren); however, there are a couple (very scarce) odd balls in neighboring counties (Surry and Wilkes) that do not seem to have any direct connection with William Tunwell VEST.

But even more intriguing…

Sources say the parents of Willis VESS are John VESS and Margret VAUGHN.

Well, while compiling marriage records, I found a PETER VEST and a “PUGNANCE VAUGHN” married on November 24, 1785 in Henry County, Virginia.



As mentioned in my last post, I have discovered a VESS family in Patrick County, Virginia who do not have any documented connections with anyone. Are they VESS or VEST?


Patrick County, VA was established in 1791 and was previously part of Henry County, VA. So, this Peter VEST (married to Pugnance VAUGHN) may be connected to the VESS family in Patrick County, VA.

Interestingly, this gives us a “Peter” VEST married in 1785 and a “Jonathan” Vess married in 1792. So, I couldn’t help but wonder... is there an older Nathaniel Vess?

There is! Well, a Nathaniel VEST, born 1791 in Virginia (died in Indiana).
It is not just the name “Nathaniel” that intrigues me, but also his spouse, whose maiden name is “DUNCAN.”

Is his spouse, Lavina DUNCAN, related to the John DUNCAN who appears on the Patrick County, VA Land Tax record with Peter and Samuel VESS??

Also, note…I found a WHITLOCK too (bottom of a 1792 Patrick CO. Land Tax record).

As usual, this intriguing find does not seem to bring us any closer to connecting the Willis VESS line to the Peter/Nathan Vess line. Nor does it bring us any closer to finding out who Peter and Nathan’s parents are…

1) Although Nathaniel VEST of Virginia is not old enough to be the father of our Peter and Nathan Vess, Jonathan and Peter VESS/VEST (of Virginia) are, BUT…

2) Our Nathan VESS was supposedly born in South Carolina and so was his parents. [Ref. 1880 Mortality Record]

3) The parents of Willis VESS were supposedly born in North Carolina. [Ref. various census records]

4) Jonathan Vess of Patrick County, Virginia who married Elizabeth Heron migrated to Republic of Texas in 1820. [Ref. Texas history]

So, who is the John Vess on Peter’s 1830 land record??



Other information that might relate to Willis VESS:

1) 1860 census record states Willis VESS was born in Indiana, but all other census records state he was born in North Carolina.

2) There is supposedly a Willis VESS in South Carolina. I will check my notes again.

3) Talitha WHITLOCK was born in Georgia (abt. 1820). Her mother is Elizabeth GREEN.

Peter’s son, Josiah VESS has a connection with a GREEN family in Rutherford County, NC through his spouse, Zilla Early. I will look to see if there are any connections.

4) Peter’s son Alfred VESS migrated to Georgia after the Civil War and I often wondered, if there was already family out there or if the war landed him there.

5) Supposedly Peter’s line eventually made it up to Indiana, but I cannot remember when or who went up there. I am not familiar with any family from Peter’s line moving to Alabama. I will double check though.

What Are Your Thoughts?

I don’t have enough evidence to make any solid conclusions about the VESS family in Patrick County, VA, but I did want to share my findings with everyone.

Please feel free to share your thoughts in the comments section or join us on the Vess Genealogy Facebook Group.