Last year, research was slow and eventually came to a halt due to an extremely hectic schedule.
I just now realized that my research ended with a major genealogy cliff-hanger regarding the recently discovered Vess family in Wilkes County, North Carolina! I’ve received a lot of new information that I am super excited to share!
I’ve just recently posted an exciting update in the sidebar regarding Y-DNA for the Travers family and the (R1a) Vess families of North Carolina and Alabama!
Please bare with me as I work on updating the website with new information and resources this month.
I am looking forward to a new year of amazing discoveries!
I am excited to announce that Vess Genealogy has expanded to a Vess Family Research Site. Of course, it is still a work in progress as I continue to improve the website with new features and more information.
Vess genealogy is challenging to research, because of its unique name in which DNA has interestingly revealed is a name shared by several different unrelated families. I would like to expand the Vess Genealogy website to help other VESS families sort out their lineages and uncover their origins.
This is a monumental task in which will require the help other researchers who are also interested in the VESS name.
While my research blog will continue, I am still working on adding new pages that will provide researchers with current information that can be found in one spot rather than having to collect information from numerous blog posts.
I am still working on creating PDF files for specific lineages and I would like to add family charts.
Further posts will have an open comment section and I am looking into creating an active Discussion Forum (that part will take time to create though) to encourage further collaboration among researchers.
The Vess Family DNA Project is still active and we continue to encourage male descendants to participate in Y-DNA testing.
Furthermore, I am currently working on a VESS Genealogy E-book for the Peter and Willis Vess lines.
I absoultely look forward to working with you to help uncover the mysteries of the VESS family!
The NEW YEAR is upon us and we have some very promising leads to get us started!
1.Vess Family of Patrick County, VA Recently we discovered that Samuel, William, and Peter Vess owned land in Patrick County, Virginia and that Samuel Vess has been in the area (Henry County) since 1782. Who is this VESS family?
2. DNA Triangulation DNA has matched the descendants of Peter and Willis Vess to possibly some families in Wilkes County, North Carolina.
a. Sparks Family b. Ephraim Pennington (I found him in Wilkes County, NC!) *DNA matches still being explored c. Hodges Family
3. Maps, Maps, and History! History and maps can teach us so much!
Did you know the Great Wagon Road crossed the North Mayo River where Samuel, William, and Peter Vess owned land in Patrick County, Virginia or that early established residents of Wilkes County, North Carolina were forced to sell their land and venture off to the west and south due to conflict?
The Sparks family settled on Hunting Creek but their property was on the border of Wilkes and Surry (now Yadkin) county. The Yadkin River was an important waterway used to travel south, as the Yadkin River turns into the PeeDee River going right through Anson and Montgomery Counties (Travis, Sugg, Pennington, and Bellew families – just to name a few).
4. William Vest of Wilkes County, North Carolina We have William Vest listed near Thomas Hodges in Wilkes County, VA. The family bio for Thomas Hodges mentions he was married in Virginia to Nancy Cottrell, but does not specify where, so I am not sure, if Thomas Hodges is related to the Hodges in Franklin County, VA that matches closely with Peter and Willis Vess. Interestingly, Cottrell is a surname that comes up frequently in my Autosomal DNA list (6-8 generations back) matching other VESS relatives – possibly a connection via COX.
In the same area (New River), per land records, is the Ephraim Pennington family (New River Pasture Branch). Unfortunately, this is a Pennington family that consists of numerous generations with the “Ephraim” name (I think 5). Further investigation is needed.
5. Whitlocks I’ve found the Whitlock’s in the Surry/Stokes County area. Some near Samuel, William, and Peter Vess of Patrick County, VA via Snow Creek (Stokes Co), near Bellew’s Creek and one in Patrick County, VA. Also, another on Hunting Creek near the Sparks family.
The Whitlock’s appear to have early connections with a Saunder family, per a probate record for Thomas Christmas (great-grandfather of Talitha Whitlock, wife of Willis Vess). We have a Saunders family in Wilkes County, VA near the Whitlock and Pennington families and early court records for Henry/Patrick County mention Col. Peter Saunders (Are there connections?).
When and where did the VESS family meet the Whitlock family? Did the Willis Vess line travel through Tennessee or South Carolina through Georgia? Did you know there is a Whitlock family in Union County, South Carolina who was also part of Stephen F. Austin’s 300 in the Republic of Texas? Did you know there is also a Willis family in Patrick County, Virginia?
Are there connections? Are we getting closer to the truth or just chasing more ghosts?
Wishing everyone a great NEW YEAR and Happy Genealogy trails!
My previous post was extensively long with so many thoughts I just had to get out of my brain. Just to clarify, I was not making any conclusions nor suggesting we are related to the BEST or VICE families. However, I was trying to point out how extremely intriguing it is that Peter and Nathan Vess are in the center of these families, yet seem to lack a solid family connection with any of them. Seems a bit odd.
I am conflicted. My gut at the moment is telling me there is a Wilkes County, NC connection, but my gut is also telling me, there is a Charles Travers connection too. However, just because the VESS family is closely related to the TRAVERS family (DNA suggesting we are descendants of TRAVERS), doesn’t mean, we split from the TRAVERS family in the United States. The VESS family could have likely spilt away from the TRAVERS line long before they crossed the Atlantic.
It is absolutely mind boggling. I feel like the truth is near, yet still very far from reach.
I am very excited about JOHN BESS/BEAS in South Carolina. I am even more excited to discover he is completely separate from the John VICE family on the 1810 census. However, research suggests John Bess, neighbors of Samuel Dunaway, is related to Boston Best (Jerg SebastianBosch). Yet, further research reveals that something is just not right…
Thinking Aloud…
Peter and Willis Vess, born in North Carolina, are proven to be genetically related to the same VESS family; however, they are found states apart from each other.
Nearby in White County, Tennessee are records of a Peter, William, and Willis Vess, with the assumption that Peter and William maybe the same Peter and William from Patrick County, Virginia.
Willis Vess supposedly has a brother named John Peter Vess, who was born in Tennessee in 1822. These findings, if related, suggest a migration from Patrick County, VA to Franklin County, Alabama; however, it doesn’t explain Peter and Nathaniel Vess in the Carolinas, unless the VESS family split apart in Wilkes County, North Carolina where we find record of William Vess.
Peter Vess in North Carolina is 31 years older than John Peter Vess in Franklin County, Alabama and he is 19 years older than Willis Vess (Alabama), but DNA suggests that Peter is more closely related to Willis Vess than he is to Nathaniel Vess, even though Nathaniel Vess lives closer to Peter. Is this due to lack of DNA testers, Nathaniel being a half-brother (more distant), or is Nathaniel Vess not related at all? Matching descendants of both Peter and Willis Vess appear on autosomal DNA tests, which suggests there is a close connection 6-8 generations back, either as brothers or 1st cousins.
Even descendants of John Peter Vess appear on autosomal DNA tests, but I can’t help but wonder, if maybe he is misplaced on the family tree. If records of Willis Vess in White County, Tennessee is Willis Vess of Franklin County, Alabama, then perhaps it isn’t too much of a stretch to wonder if John Peter Vess (who married a Whitlock) is the son of Willis Vess.
However, the families we are following from Patrick County, VA to Franklin County, Alabama is missing a JOHN VESS! According to Anna Popejoy, the father of Willis Vess is John Vess and he settled in the Foxtrap area of Franklin County, Alabama in 1819. Peter’s land record in 1831, suggests an older John Vess (perhaps a father or brother). And, according to the Nathaniel Vess line, they are related to Jonathan William Vess and Elizabeth Heron (married in Patrick County, VA) who settled in the Republic of Texas in the 1820’s (clearly not the same John Vess as Foxtrap).
Jonathan William Vess could have connections to South Carolina, for that there are records of James Heron having property near Peter and William Vess in Patrick County, VA as well as property in Abbeville County, South Carolina. Perhaps there are two different James Heron families, but we also know that many of the families in South Carolina settled in Franklin County, Alabama.
We also have records of James Heron having property next to a mysterious Vess family in Tazewell County, Virginia (not too far from the VESS/VEST family in Rockbridge, VA and not to far from the VICE family across the Cumberland Gap in Kentucky and a Henry Vice in Washington County, VA.) Also, in this area in Virginia is the WHITE family that Elizabeth Vess, wife of Jonathan Vess, married after Jonathan’s death in Texas.
We also have a Samuel Vess associated with Peter Vess in Patrick County, Virginia. Samuel Vess seems to be connected with the Vess family in Rockbridge County, VA – via Hiram Vess. Are there two Samuel Vess families in Virginia?
Then, if we take a look at South Carolina, we have a John VICE, John BESS, a mysterious Henry and James Vist, and the BEST family. Mixed in between both Virginia and South Carolina are the VOSS families.
Haplogroups – Y DNA
Vess and Travers Families -Haplogroup R1a
Peter and Willis Vess are descendants of the TRAVERS family from Lancashire, England (Haplogroup R1a). Unfortunately, there is a huge gap in our lineage between 1650 (estimated date as to when we split from one known Travers family) to 1791 (birth of Peter Vess). At some point, in between, our lineage took on the VESS name, which may have evolved from TRAVESS (Travis).
The VESS name is modernly new and research strongly supports it is a surname that originated in America. Statistics today, reveal that the VESS surname is predominately found in the United States and the name is greatly linked to the Peter and Nathaniel Vess families of North Carolina. The TRAVIS name evolved from the TRAVERS family from Ireland (who settled in the Carolina’s) and perhaps some from England (who settled in Dorchester, Maryland). At this time, we know that the Peter Vess line (descendants of Travers) broke apart from the Travers family in Maryland sometime prior to 1650 in England. However, Y-DNA appears to confirm that the England Travers and Ireland Travers are of the same family. The question that remains, is which line did Peter and Willis Vess descend from?
Our family story states that Peter, Jonathan, and Nathaniel Vess came from Ireland, which would lead us to assume we may have connections with the Travers / Travis family in the Carolinas, for that they are descendants of the Travers family from Ireland (Robert Travers). But, if we are related to Peter and William Vess in Patrick County, VA, could we have come from an unknown Travers in Maryland, who may have Ireland roots, rather than English roots like the known Travers in Dorchester, Maryland? Many families from Maryland traveled the Great Wagon Road down through the Virginia counties we find a mix of VESS, VEST, and VICE families.
VOSS/ VAUX/ VASS Families – Haplogroup Unknown
We do have a John VOSS documented in Caroline County, Maryland, next to Dorchester, Maryland (he seems a bit out of place). *Note: Jarvis Willis in Tennessee has land along the same river as Peter and William Vess in White County, TN and his family comes from Caroline County, Maryland. The Sparks family found in Wilkes County, NC and Rutherford County, NC also come from Caroline County, Maryland.
Near Maryland in Virginia we have the Robert Vaux family (descendants of the ancient De Vallibus family). We do not know what Haplogroup they belong to.
Further south in Virginia, we have records of a John Voss, who has some descendants that are documented to settle in South Carolina via Joseph VOSS. The son of Joseph Voss, William Voss, married Elizabeth ORR in Meckenlenburg County, NC and they settled Lawerence County, Tennessee (just above Franklin County, Alabama). This VOSS family is shown to be related to a Henry Voss, who left Virginia having owed a lot of debt to a neighbor. Early records only show a BASS family; however, most recently, I’ve discovered an early HENRY BESS record in South Carolina. Also note, that the 1810 census for Spartanburg County, SC has a Henry VIST listed, next to a James Vist.
It is speculated that the VOSS and VASS families are related. The VASS family is related to Vincent VASS who settled on the North Carolina coast (having spent time in Stokes County, NC). The VASS family is located geographically close to the Travers family from Ireland; however, no correlations have been found. They also seem to intertwine with the VOSS family who are also found in Casewell County, North Carolina, where John VICE and Frances Roebuck of South Carolina married and where we find Greenbury Voss/Vess.
According to researchers, the origins of the VOSS and VASS families are unknown. It is supsected that they are related to the VAUX family, but that has yet to be confirmed, nor are there any active DNA projects that reveal their Haplogroup.
Vice Family – Haplogroup Unknown As mentioned earlier, one of the Vice families are found in Casewell County, NC (where we have a mix of VOSS and VASS families). The Vice family Haplogroup is unknown, but they are interestingly found near the VESS family of Rockbridge County, VA and the many families of interest associated with Peter and Nathaniel Vess in the Carolinas.
According to their family story, their earliest known ancestor is John Vessey from Frederick County, Virginia.
Mysterious VESS Haplogroup R1b A recent Vess family whose records go back to Tazewell County, VA (1850) reveal themselves to be Haplogroup R1b. According to researchers, their earliest known ancestor for this Vess family maybe a “Henry Vess,” who seems to have connections with Patrick County, VA. In my opinion, based on recent research, is that he maybe he is related to Henry VICE, who I found living in between Patrick County, VA and Tazewell County, VA.
Vess family of Rockbridge- Haplogroup Unknown I was informed that the Vess family of Rockbridge may be descendants of the WEST family. The West family’s Haplogroup is R1b. However, the Rockbridge VESS/VEST family is related to Samuel Vess/Vest. Again, is this the same Samuel Vess associated with Peter Vess in Patrick County, Virginia?
Also in Rockbridge, I have found that the VICE and VEST families having passed through. Are they related?
VEST Family- Haplogroup I
Y-DNA testing has confirmed that Peter and Willis Vess are not related to William Tunwell Vest of Stokes County, North Carolina. William Tunwell Vest is a descendant of John Daniel Vest of Chesterfield County, Virginia and their Haplogroup is I, drastically different than our VESS Haplogroup R1a.
BASS Family – Descendants of Native Americans We can rule out a BASS family connection. They are Native American with lineages originating from Norfolk, Virginia. This doesn’t mean we should disregard records with the BASS name for that VESS records could easily be misspelled as BASS.
BEST / BOSCH Family North Carolina- Haplogroup Unknown The Best family of Lincoln County, North Carolina is very well documented. Records can be traced all the way back to the boat they arrived on to America and they arrived with the Ecker family. Again, this doesn’t we should disregard records with the BEST name, for that VESS records could easily be misspelled at BEST – even today, the VESS name is often mistaken as BEST (I know from personal experience).
Interestingly, I have discovered more BEST families in North Carolina who do not seem to be related to the Sebastian Best, yet found closely near the wandering VOSS families.
DUNAWAY
This is the record (below) that sparked my gears to turn! Nathaniel Vice in Kentucky married Sarah DUNAWAY.
As per my previous post on John Bess, he appears to be connected with Samuel Dunaway. He is listed near Samuel Dunaway on census records, Dunaway is listed on his 1810 land record, and he signed as a witness on Samuel Dunaway’s will in South Carolina.
Records show that Samuel Dunaway and John Bess lived on Thicketty Creek, which is quite distant from the VICE family on Enroee River. According to the book, Tryon County, North Carolina Minutes of the court of Pleas and Quarter Sessions 1769-1799, Samuel Dunaway Sr. was a constable. Thicketty Creek area was also once part of Tryon County.
However, John BESS and the John VICE families are separate families, confirmed by the 1810 census (showing John VICE and his sons, Nathaniel, George, and John Roebuck Vice together) and John Bess near Dunaway and Henry Pettit. Note: Peter is on census listed with Henry Pettit in 1820 Rutherford County, NC. It is documented that Henry Pettit is from South Carolina (son of Joshua Pettit).
Yet, we have Nathaniel Vice in Kentucky married to a Dunaway. Is there a connection? Also, the father of Nathaniel Vice in Kentucky is said to be NATHANIEL CAMP VICE.
This is interesting, because the CAMP family, traveled down from Frederick County, VA (where Nathaniel Vice is from) and settled in Rutherford County, North Carolina on Island Ford – just a few miles away from Sandy Run. In fact, Benjamin Camp has land on Sandy Run (Tyron County). Sandy Run is where we find Henry Pettit and Peter Vess in 1820, in addition to long time residents: Bridges, Young, Webb, Logan, Sparks, Hambrick, and Willis families. Also note, that Thicketty Creek is not too far from Sandy Run.
BUT, the BEST family throws in a monkey wrench, for that some family trees claim that JOHN BESS of Spartanburg County, South Carolina is John Best or some say Jacob Best, son of Boston Best. And, the 1790 census record, shows a connection: Here we have Samuel Dunaway with Boston Best, Henry Pettit, and Joshua Pettit.
This is likely Boston Best JR., because Boston Sr. is in Lincoln County, NC in 1790, near the Gosnell family. Gosnell is connected to Nathaniel Vess.
Something Not Right
Now, here is where something doesn’t seem right. The family trees of John Bess of Spartanburg County, South Carolina are not consistent. John Bess (Jr) born in 1815 settled in Warren County, Tennessee. This John Bess is listed as the son of either John Bess Sr. (son of Boston Best) or John Bess Sr. (son of Thomas Hobbs). I do not know who Thomas Hobbs is.
From my perspective, John Best, son of Boston Best Sr. died in Lincoln County. He is shown on the 1790 census with Boston Best Sr. and his brother Jacob Best. So, it is unlikely that John Bess is John/Jacob Best, son of Boston Best Sr. However, Boston Jr. appears to be in Spartanburg County, SC in 1790 (away from his family in Lincoln County, NC).
Boston Best Jr. could of had a son named John Best, but is he John BESS that went to Warren County, TN. According to the HENNESSEE Family webpage, John Bess of Spartanburg County, SC (b. 1783) married Lucinda Kimberlin. I do not know when they moved to Tennessee, but their youngest son is noted to have been born in Tennessee in 1817.
John Bess of Spartanburg County, SC who is associated with the Dunaway family on census, appears to have been born between 1766-1784. He obtained land on Thicketty Creek in 1810 and is listed on Dunaway’s will dated 1815. So, John Bess could certainly be the John Bess who went to Warren County, Tennessee. So perhaps, this John Bess is the son of Boston Best Jr. Unfortunately, there is very little documentation on Boston Best Jr.
How Does VESS Fit In?
What boggles my brain the most is how Peter and Nathan Vess are smack dab in the middle! Is Nathan Vess a BESS, with BOSCH origins? If anything, the Gosnell-Best connection seems to fit very well for him. Is Nathan part of our of VESS family story, because he is geographically close to Peter? Is Peter related to Nathan via a VICE – CAMP- DUNAWAY connection on Sandy Run?? Which may also explain a distant genetic connection.
Why does Fredrick BASS keep popping up all over the place too – in Wilkes County, NC and Anson County, NC near Bellew, Sparks, Rose, and Sugg families, near Charles Travers. Is Frederick Bass the son of Boston Best known as Frederick Best???
The Suggs family moved from Anson County, NC to Franklin County, Alabama near Willis Vess. They were listed as neighbors of Charles Travers in Anson County (when it was Mecklenburg- making them neighbors of BEST family), and according to Charles’ family bio, there is mention of a connection with David Benson. David Benson is shown on census with the Gosnell and Bellew families in South Carolina (1790). Also, it is suspected that Charles Travers is a descendant of Robert Travers from Ireland.
Is there a connection and if so, how is it all connected???
In August of 2020, I discovered two John Vess families in South Carolina whose origins are a mystery.
The first is an 1850 census record for John and William E. Vess of Saluda Regiment, Abbeville, South Carolina. Both of them are in their 20’s, they are listed as carpenters, and they claim to be born in North Carolina.
The second is an 1850 census record for John Vess and Drucilla Vess of Saluda, Abbeville, South Carolina. John is 25 and he is listed as a farmer. 1860 census, suggests John Vess died, for that it is just Drucilla Turner and James Vest (assuming their son).
Today, I came across Civil War records for John Vess and William VESTZ (pretty sure it’s William Vess). The first record, John Vess states he enlisted in Greenville, South Carolina and his occupation is a carpenter. These two records, might be referring to John and William Vess from the 1850 census. According to these records, John Vess was hospitalized and William was captured. I am not sure if they survived the war though.
In between John Vess and William Vestz, is a Civil War record for JOHN VEST. He too was enlisted in Greenville, South Carolina. What makes his record so interesting, is that he was forced to write a letter asking to be discharged from the military due to his age. The discharge was granted, which means this John Vest was born sometime before 1815.
Fold3: Civil War Record and Letter Certifying His Age
I found an 1880 census record for a John Vest in Greenville, South Carolina with a birth year that would put him at the approx. same age as John Vest in the Civil War record above. This John Vest (1880 census) was born about 1815 in South Carolina and states both his parents were born in South Carolina.
This is very intriguing, because there are no early records of a VEST or VESS family in South Carolina. All we know is that we have records that strongly suggest that Nathaniel Vess was born in South Carolina in 1794 with a connection to Greenville, South Carolina via Clarinda Bellew who also states both his parents were born in South Carolina (below). Could Nathan Vess and John Vest be related???
When it comes to the North Carolina VESS family tree, we can all pretty much agree that our earliest known ancestor is Peter Vess; however, Peter was not the only VESS family in North Carolina during his time. According to the 1830 census, Nathaniel Vess and Clarinda Bellew (with her father John Bellew) were also in Rutherford County, North Carolina. For the most part, our family trees from these two men are pretty accurate; however, what if I told you that Sarah Jane Vess (wife of Jackson Pressley), shown as a descendant of Nathaniel Vess, might actually be a descendant of Peter Vess??
DISCLAIMER:
Please note that the information provided within this post is a personal opinion based on personal interpretation of genealogical records and DNA data. Individual researchers and readers are strongly encouraged to do their own research and come to their own conclusions.
Only 1 Connection With The Nathaniel Vess Line
It’s odd, but all my DNA connections to the Nathaniel Vess line are all through the descendants of Sarah Jane Vess and Jackson Pressley.
Now, I just assumed that maybe descendants of other Nathaniel Vess lines are just not testing or maybe DNA relatives are too distant to show up as a DNA match (perhaps Peter and Nathan Vess are half-brothers or cousins). There is also the possibility, I am related to this particular Nathaniel Vess line via my mother’s side who also has deep Carolina roots, but there are other descendants of Peter Vess reporting the same particular Nathaniel Vess connection (so, it’s clearly not on my mother’s side).
However, just recently, Vince informed me that a new tool called, Theory of Family Relativity on myHeritage.com, suggests the descendants of Sarah Jane Vess and Jackson Pressley may be related to Peter Vess via his son John Vess.
That’s a lot to take in!
So, I decided to dust off some old research notebooks and take another look at Nathaniel and Peter Vess.
Sarah Jane Vess VS Mary Jane Vess
Reviewing numerous family trees for Nathaniel Vess, his daughter is often listed as either “Sarah“ Jane Vess or “Mary” Jane Vess; both shown as the wife of Jackson Pressley.
Many researchers have noted that Sarah and Mary are probably the same person, whereas others list them as separate people. However, upon further investigation, Sarah Jane Vess and Mary Jane Vess appear to be two different people who just so happened to be born at the same time (1840) and both have connections to Haywood County, North Carolina!
So, who is who?
In my opinion, based on genealogical records, Mary Jane Vess is likely the daughter of Nathaniel Vess and Clarinda Bellew, whereas Sarah Jane Vess is likely the daughter of John Vess, son of Peter Vess. I come to this conclusion based on marriage and census records, in addition, to the history of John Vess.
What We Know About John Vess (Peter’s son)
John Vess was born about 1820 in North Carolina to Peter and Catherine Vess. He married Elizabeth Taylor and they had 4 children together: Sarah, Silus, Mary, and Sophrona.
Silus and Mary appeared to have died young, Sarah appears to have disappeared, and Sophrona married Columbus Summey.
John Vess disappeared after 1850, during the same time the rest of the Vess family kind of split up; presumably after the death of Catherine. In 1854, we have a newspaper clipping announcing a Petition for Divorce between Elizabeth and John Vess, suggesting John Vess had moved out of state. During the same year, Elizabeth reverts back to her maiden name and marries Joshua Souther. We find her and her children (Viss) living with Joshua Souther in Henderson County, North Carolina in 1860.
Henderson County, NC Makes The Difference
Sarah Jane Vess and Jackson Pressely were married in 1856 and according to the 1860 census record, Sarah and Jackson were living in Henderson County, North Carolina, same county as Elizabeth and Joshua Souther.
In 1860, Mary Jane Vess, was still living with her parents Nathaniel and Clarinda Vess (Vert) in Haywood County, North Carolina. So, clearly not the same the person.
In 1863, Mary Jane Vess married Phillip Davis in Haywood County, North Carolina.
A connection with the Davis family makes sense, considering Andrew Jackson Vess (son of Nathaniel Vess) supposedly married Mary Davis in 1862.
I think the confusion between Sarah Jane Vess and Mary Jane Vess is with their connection to Haywood County, NC, for that we know that Nathan’s family once lived in Haywood County, NC. However, Sarah Jane Vess doesn’t appear in Haywood County until 1870 with Jackson Pressely, after Nathan’s family moved to Tennessee.
I did find a few family trees showing Mary Jane Vess as a descendant of Nathaniel Vess married to Phillip Davis, instead of Jackson Pressley, and interestingly, I am not a DNA match.
Also, I noticed a lot of family trees stating Sarah / Mary Jane Vess died in Washington. However, I believe Sarah Jane Vess, wife of Jackson Pressley, was remarried to a man named Eli Glen, where she eventually moved to Georgia (below). Further research is needed though and surprisingly opens up an entirely new theory about John Vess’s whereabouts about his divorce with Elizabeth Taylor (to be shared in a later post).
Based on genealogical evidence, I am convinced that Mary Jane Vess and Phillip Davis are part of the Nathaniel Vess line whereas Sarah Jane Vess and Jackson Pressley are part of the Peter Vess line.
Connection Between Peter Vess and Nathan Vess Still A Mystery
Well, Sarah Jane Vess was my only DNA connection to Nathaniel Vess. Now, that research strongly supports her connection with Peter Vess instead of Nathan Vess, does that mean Peter and Nathan are not related?? No way!
My Autosomal DNA only goes back 6-8 generations. It barely picks up the descendants of Peter’s children, so technically, if Nathan and Peter are related, it would likely be too distant to show up on my Autosomal DNA test results.
We really need a male Vess descendant from Nathaniel Vess’s line to do a Y-DNA test to confirm a genetic connection between Nathaniel, Peter, and Willis Vess. Until then, we can only assume they are related and we must continue to search for genealogical evidence to confirm their family relationship to one another.
If there is one thing in Vess Genealogy that bothers me the most, it is the close genetic connection between Peter and Willis Vess. I mean, how are they so closely related?
A number of descendants of Willis Vess show as DNA matches on my Autosomal DNA test, which means there is an early connection somewhere between 6-8 generations back. For me, my 3rd great-grandfather, Andrew Logan Vess, would be the 6th generation. Is Willis Vess the brother of Peter Vess?
Andrew Logan Vess
Before we found out that Peter and Willis Vess were part of the same Vess family (via Y-DNA), I figured I must be connected to Willis Vess through an ancestor on my mother’s side, whose family also had deep roots in Georgia and the Carolinas. But, now I know descendants of Willis Vess also show up as DNA matches for a number of other descendants of Peter Vess.
So, where does Peter and Willis Vess fall on the Vess family tree?
Consistent Geographical Places
As research continues, we have discovered that the Vess family live in communities whose residents appear to be consistently associated with the same geographical places:
1. Enroee River, Spartanburg County, South Carolina 2. Abbeville County, South Carolina 3. Wilkes County, North Carolina 4. White County, Tennessee
You would think that mountainous terrain and dangerous confrontations with Native Americans would have hindered families from traveling large distances; however, that is far from the truth. Many early families owned and maintained land in other states; in which often required the head of household to travel back and forth for business. A lot of families were also uprooted due to wars or the expansion of the new frontier.
Connections To Abbeville County, South Carolina
What also boggles my mind, is that while we find early Vess families in communities associated with common geographical places, there still appears to be no early existence of the Vess family. Generally, one would expect to find at least 1 or 2 close relatives hanging around nearby, as families often traveled together. But in our case, it is as if Peter and Willis Vess, even Jonathan and Nathaniel Vess, seemingly appear into their community out of nowhere!
What is even more curious, is that Alfred Webb Vess, son of Peter Vess, settled in Georgia (prior to the Civil War), while the rest of the Vess family pretty much stayed in North Carolina. Why did he move out of state?
Alfred Webb Vess
It is interesting to note, that he left North Carolina in the early 1850’s, which may have been after the death of his mother, Catherine. In 1860, the entire Rutherford County, N.C. Vess family is shown having had split their ways, with the youngest of Peter and Catherine’s children shown to be living with another family (largely suggesting Catherine had died).
I have yet to figure out why the youngest children of Peter and Catherine went to live with a man named Dempsey Sumner in Buncombe County, NC. I have not found any evidence suggesting any kind of family connection between them. However, I do have reason to believe, Sumner may have given Jasper an apprenticeship, for that Jasper later acquired some of him land. [Note: Indentured servant contracts were still going on prior to the Civil War.]
Alfred Webb Vess married Mary Elizabeth McFarlin, daughter of Benjamin McFarlin and Nancy Stone. They married in 1853, in Franklin County, Georgia, not too far from Mary’s roots in Abbeville County, South Carolina.
Is that a clue that the Vess family also had early roots in Abbeville County, South Carolina, as other research suggests? Was there Vess family in Abbeville County, SC that Alfred went to after Catherine’s death?
Franklin County, Georgia- Abbeville County, South Carolina
This intrigues me, because many residents in Franklin County, Alabama also have earlier connections with Abbeville County, SC. Jonathan Vess of Texas also appears to have connections with Abbeville County, SC, through the families his children married (like McBee and McCullough families). In addition, James Heron (from Patrick County, VA) also owns land in Abbeville County, South Carolina and do not even get me started on the bulk of Travis families who descend from Cork, Ireland also living in Abbeville County, SC, with one of them becoming an important part of early Texas history [William B. Travis: The Battle of the Alamo].
Exploring The TRAVESS Name
Earlier this week, I’ve started to explore the TRAVESS name. I find it interesting that this name is found in Caroline County, Maryland. Although Y-DNA tells us there is no recent connection between the Vess family and the Travers family of Dorchester, Maryland (next to Caroline County); that doesn’t mean, a different Travers family (perhaps with a similar name) wasn’t ever in Maryland. The TRAVESS name, is interestingly, a name that can also be found in both England and Ireland, particularly in Lancashire, England and Donegal (not Cork), Ireland.
Unfortunately, there is no DNA evidence (as of yet) suggesting a connection with any early TRAVESS families (not even sure if TRAVESS is even related to TRAVERS); however, it is a name variant (along with TRAVIS) that we might want to take in consideration when exploring these earlier common geographical places; as it is abundantly clear that our family’s mysterious tracks throughout early Colonial America are hidden behind a different surname.
The VICE family seems like great candidates as possible VESS ancestors due to their connection with the PETTIT family in South Carolina, but I doubt there is a paternal-link. We just don’t share the same origin stories and I find that strange. I would think different lines of our early ancestors would share a similar family story regarding Ireland.
If you think about it, every version of our family origin story always has 3 consistent parts: Ireland, 3 brothers, and a name change. No matter what, these 3 elements appear to mean a lot to our VESS family.
Of course, family stories are not 100% accurate, but surely they must contain some ounce of truth that can provide us clues to our past. I mean, the stories had to come from somewhere?
I have often wondered if the Ireland aspect came about because of Tryon County (abolished county in North Carolina) that could easily be misinterpreted later as the County of Tyrone in Ireland. However, the Peter Vess line spent generations in one place (McDowell County) that was once part of Tryon County. How would they not know Tryon County ever existed??
Also, I must admit, I’ve only heard family stories about Ireland from the Peter Vess line. What have the Willis Vess and Nathaniel Vess lines been told? Is it similar? Have they been told they come from Ireland too?
The VICE family intrigues me for the consistent name of NATHANIEL and JOHN throughout their family tree. However, according to several sources that I found online, the VICE family is supposedly Welsh in origin. Those descending from Nathaniel Vice and Dorcas Meadows supposedly have a connection with Pochahantas (now surely our family wouldn’t leave that part out). Carolyar.com
Other sources say they are Dutch (Frederick Count, VA had a Dutch population). AND, despite having the name VESSEY on their family tree – stories say he came from England. I have not found any stories suggesting any kind of connection to Ireland.
Their English origins intrigue me, because I feel as if VESS DNA is predominately English. It is my understanding that the Y-DNA Haplogroup we descend from is English/Scottish, which has recently taken me into a new direction away from the VICE family, but interestingly, not too far away from the VICE family.
As of right now, for me, the VICE family is a DEAD END; at least until a male VICE descendant tests their Y-DNA or we stumble across some significant genealogy record that can confirm a solid connection. In the mean time, research in South Carolina has not gone to waste!
Researching the families in South Carolina (especially, Abbeville) where we find a mysterious John Vess and Drucilla Turner (1850), has some interesting findings related to an unknown VICE family, a TRAVERS family from Cork Ireland, and a ghost VOSS family who appears to have eluded the census records yet mysteriously pop up in other family records (like Wills and accounting papers)!
Research strongly suggests that Peter, Willis, and Nathan Vess may have common connections in South Carolina. In this post, we begin to explore these possible connections.
Please note that the opinions and thoughts in this post are based on my own personal point of view researching these families. Links to sources are provided to allow the reader / researcher to form their own opinions, thoughts, and conclusions.
Mapping Out Families
Using information obtained by South Carolina Digital Records, I was able to map a few families that may have connections with our earliest known ancestors: Pool, Pettit, Bellew, and Willis families. *Toney and Nicholl records have also been found, but are not mapped above.
Pool and Pettit families lived along the Pacelot River below Lawson’s Fork.
Bellew and Willis families lived along Fair Forest Creek.
Vice and Hembree families lived along Cain Creek branching out from the Tyger River.
Peter Vess: Pettit & Toney Families
According to Peter’s 1820 census record, he is listed next to David Mooney, Henry Pettit, James Young, and Abraham Toney. The Pettit and Toney families married each other and were members of Bill’s Creek Baptist Church with Peter Vess. [Bill’s Creek Baptist Church: Two Hundred Year History, by Helen M. Lu].
According to North Carolina’s Land grants and deed website and various other sources, David Mooney’s family has been in this area of North Carolina since the 1760’s (Tryon County), having traveled with the Eacker family. Living nearby in Lincoln County, North Carolina is the Boston Best and Charles Gosnell family. Boston Best has early land records in Tryon County, but I not sure if those properties are in modern-day North Carolina or South Carolina.
Interestingly, Boston Best (I believe to be Jr.) is on the 1790 Spartanburg County, South Carolina census record [below] near Henry Pettit, while his father Boston Best Sr. is listed next to Charles Gosnell in the 1790 Lincoln County, North Carolina census record. Charles Gosnell’s son, Joshua Gosnell, is listed next to Abraham Belue (Bellew) on the 1790 Spartanburg County, South Carolina census record – a few pages over from Henry Pettit.
Also, John Vice/Vise is on the same page of the 1790 Spartanburg County, South Carolina census record as Henry Pettit, but listed as John “Wise.” We can safely assume John “Wise” is John Vice, based on other families on the same page, such as Joel Hembree (Embry) who is a neighbor of John Vice per land records.
We know the Toney family was also in South Carolina. They appear to have been in South Carolina as early as the Revolutionary War (like Henry Pettit). I found a Toney family with a land record in Tyger River dated the same year that John Vice obtained land in the Tyger River area too [below].
According to family trees for the Toney family, Abraham Toney of Rutherford County, North Carolina (with Peter Vess) is supposedly related to Timothy Toney of South Carolina. There are numerous Abraham’s on the family tree and 2 of them went by William (Abraham William Toney) which has caused a lot of confusion, so further research is needed to confirm the two Toney families are related.
Also, I see John Stovall next to Henry Pettit on the 1790 census. I believe Ann Pool, Henry’s wife, is related to the Stovall family (her maternal line) and the Stovall family had connections with the prominent PENN and HAIRSTON families in Patrick County, Virginia where we find William and Peter Vess [1790-1801 Patrick County Deeds].
Dunneway is also an interesting name on the 1790 census [above]. There is a marriage record for Nathaniel Vice and Sarah Dunaway in Kentucky (1802). This is supposedly Nathaniel Vice Jr., brother of John Vice Sr. in South Carolina. There appears to be confusion over the numerous Nathaniels in the Vice family tree, so it is not certain how they are actually connected, further research is needed.
According to the Vice family trees, Nathaniel and John Vice are brothers…do they, perhaps have a brother named Peter? And, would this Peter have been the Peter from Patrick County, Virginia? If the VICE and VESS families are the same family, is this where our oral tradition about the three brothers: Peter, John, and Nathaniel come from?
Nathan Vess: Bellew & Gosnell Families
Nathan’s wife, Clarinda Bellew is supposedly a descendant of the Gosnell/Bellew families of the Dark Corners of South Carolina (Glassy Mountain, Greenville Co. SC) with her father being John Bellew and her mother being Clarinda Gosnell.
We can find Nathan Vess and John Bellew on the 1830 Rutherford County, North Carolina census record.
On the 1790 Spartanburg County, South Carolina census record [below], we have Joshua Gosnell (son of Charles Gosnell of Lincoln County, NC) and Abraham Bellew, who is supposedly Clarinda Bellew’s grandfather.
There are numerous records for the Bellew (Belue, Bellew) family in South Carolina, prior to them settling in Glassy Mountain, Greenville County. One record of interest, is a 1774 record for Abraham Belue on Dutchmans Creek along Tyger River [below]. This is dated much earlier than the Vice family; however, Pruitt is a name that appears to be connected to the Pettit and Vice families. Of course, further investigation is needed here too.
Coincidence or Fact: Mac-Hugh Story
According to one of our family’s oral traditions about an O’Donnell-Vess, the Vess family supposedly came over with an O’Neil and an O’Donnell family from Ireland. O’Neill, wanted by the English Crown, supposedly changed his name to Mac Hugh (for his red hair) and was highly respected by the Vess family.
This oral tradition is said to have been very important to the Vess family (descendants of David Andrew Vess and Magnolia Gosnell). Upon further investigation, I found that this story appears to be similar to 2 actual historical events: The O’Donnell and O’Neil clans from Northern Ireland (1500’s) and the infamous outlaw of South Carolina’s Dark Corners, Lewis Redmond.
Knowing more about the Dark Corners of South Carolina and its residents, it is extremely interesting a William “Readmond” and Thomas “Neal”are listed next to the Gosnell and Bellew families on the 1790 Spartanburg County, South Carolina census [above]; especially, since the Gosnell and Bellew families settled in Greenville County, South Carolina, in an area where Lewis Redmond will become a well-respected outlaw. Is he a descendant of William Readmond and were the Bellew, Gosnell, and Vess families connected to the Readmond and Neil families?
Willis Vess: Willis, Ligon, and Other Families
Willis Vess was supposedly born in 1810 in North Carolina, but records of him do not appear until 1830 in Franklin County, Alabama. Interestingly, sources say some of the Vice families migrated to Alabama and there is a document on Ancestry.com that was posted in 2011, stating John Roebuck Vise Sr. and Martha Pruitt having had a child named Willis born in 1810. Unfortunately, this does not confirm Willis Vise and Willis Vess are the same person. But, perhaps there is a connection…
The oldest children of Willis Vess and Talitha Whitlock married into the John Willis family who are shown to be neighbors in Foxtrap, Franklin County, Alabama [below].
Looking at South Carolina records, I came across the Ligon name (Robert Ligon) on a land record for John Pool [below]. Note: Pool, Rogers and Meadows have connections with the Vice family.
Then, looking at the Franklin Co. Alabama plat map [below], there in the Foxtrap area with Willis Vess and John Willis, is listed James and Abner Ligon. Further research states that James and Abner Ligon are the sons of Robert Ligon in South Carolina. Also, James Dubois is a family that was in Foxtrap as early as 1820, possibly one of the earlier settlers of the area and Dubois is also a name found in early records of Tyger River community in South Carolina.
Below is another interesting record. Here we find the Nicholls family (also found in Franklin County, Alabama) on a land record with the following families: Meadows (married Nathaniel Vice) Pettit (married Mary Vice) Rogers (neighbors of John Vice) Willis (maybe related to John Willis)
So, I can’t help but wonder: Could Willis Vess be related to the Vice family of South Carolina? And, could John Willis, neighbors of Willis Vess, be related to Richard Willis?
So many interesting discoveries and still so many more questions; butit appears that South Carolina may be the key to unraveling the mysteries of the Vess family!
Vess Genealogy 